Members intelligence

[Faith 2019]

Was asked to start a new thread dealing with the subject dealing with our intelligence as faithful fans of the Buffyverse. Are we above the norms of intelligence because we are fans of Buffy the Vampire Slayer or are we below the norms of intelligence because we are fans of Buffy. Saying we have intelligence or lacking intelligence is in my judgment is a moot point. Because, I do not feel a person has any intelligence unless that person has the ability or has a PhD.

 

[nightshade]

Well by your scale I'm very stupid as I never went to Uni.

 

[The Bronze]

Buffy fans are no different from any other group. You get some smart people and some less smart people. I think this place attracts above average posters for the most part. I think it's just more of an attractive outlet for their thoughts.

Not everyone has the time, money or inclination to complete a PhD. It's hardly a relevant scale to judge people.

 

[Skanky Vamp]

Having a PhD has nothing to do with one's intelligence but everything to do with one's perseverance, devotion and resources.

 

[one eyed chicklet]

I’m not stupid because I haven’t finished sixth form yet, I’m stupid because I’m stupid.

 

[nightshade]

I’m stupid because I’m stupid.

I'm definitely this!

 

[Faith 2019]

I’m not stupid because I haven’t finished sixth form yet, I’m stupid because I’m stupid.

If you have a identical twin sister and both of you decoded to confront each other. Would you be fighting to prove who is more stupid or fighting to prove who is smarter? If your fighting to prove who is more stupid, it is more self hatefulness. If your fighting to prove who is more smarter, it is more dealing with narcissistic personality disorder.

 

[Bop]

I do think you have to be kind of emotionally intelligent to appreciate Buffy and Angel, it’s not really for an average viewer.

 

[HowiMetdaSlayer]

Just saying! 😳

 

[The Bronze]

If you have a identical twin sister and both of you decoded to confront each other.

£10 on @genghiskhan if she can triumph over the horse sized duck first.

 

[Mr. Pointy]

I tnink we can all agree that any fan of BTVS or ATS is just innately smart by whatever measure you choose 😉

 

[Faith 2019]

£10 on @genghiskhan if she can triumph over the horse sized duck first.

@genghiskham
I think she is smarter then she really is. Even that Buffy had violent conflict with women, I do not see a violent conflict with a woman is productive. I can see her beating me up and I am on the flood and bleeding all over the place.

 

[nightshade]

My mother is an identical twin (although I'm not sure I believe it) and they went separate ways when it came to learning, just because you are twins to doesn't mean you learn the same things.

Two people could do exactly the same studies but learn different things from it.

 

[TriBel]

As I said on the other thread - I've got a bloody PhD. All it does is validate the intelligence I started out with and testify, to use @Spanky 's words, to my "perseverance, devotion and resources". It didn't teach me how to think - just gave me the language with which to express my thoughts. Yes...I gained "knowledge" but it wasn't knowledge that wasn't available to others - I just read a few books is all. It was hard work...time consuming...it's easy to become obsessed (I did...but I'm obsessive at the best of times). It was also incredibly self indulgent and I (somewhat perversely) enjoyed it. Truth be known, it was easier than looking after kids (I had three kids under five when I started it).

I don't hold any truck with the idea it was a solo effort or it makes me more intelligent than others. I was fortunate in the sense that: I had a scholarship (thank you Uni.); I went to a grammar school and then Uni before fees were introduced (thank you - or not - The State); I inherited a reasonable amount of intelligence from my parents (thank you Mum and Dad). Am I proud of having one? No. Am I proud of getting one? Yeah. I was the first member of my family to go to University. I grew up on a coal board estate in the North of England and my dad was a miner. He was proud and that's really all that matters to me. My lads will moan I neglected them while I was doing it (I probably did...but I'd have done that anyway) but they've each got two degrees so I claim I was the catalyst for their achievements.

Am I glad I have one? Yeah...suppose so. It got me a job that pays well, that's flexible and with a good pension. Am I a nerd? No. I'm becoming more obsessed with Geek culture but I put that down to the attraction of a) Robert Downey and b) Tom Ellis. Do I have emotional intelligence...kinda. I can also be callous and cynical but people tend to like me for it. Have I covered every base? Good. Just to reiterate - IMO, having a PhD doesn't necessarily mean you're more or less intelligent than someone without one. There's no mystique to it. It simply means you've been rubber-stamped by an institution. You're certifiable.

I’m not stupid because I haven’t finished sixth form yet, I’m stupid because I’m stupid.

No...you're stupid because you live on the wrong side of the Pennines. 😊*

Would you be fighting to prove who is more stupid or fighting to prove who is smarter?

My twins occasionally fight. I think it proves they're both stupid.

*I don't think you're stupid at all. That's my professional opinion. 😊

On the question of BtVS, I think studies show that BtVS fans tend to be better qualified than other fandoms. If I can find the study, I'll post it.

 

[Faith 2019]

My mother is an identical twin (although I'm not sure I believe it) and they went separate ways when it came to learning, just because you are twins to doesn't mean you learn the same things.

Two people could do exactly the same studies but learn different things from it.

In real life the differences with education between two identical twins separated apart does have a mild differences. Still, in general most end their formal education at the same level. Even with the wish to become more educated, like reading nonfiction books or reading books that are the cannon books of any university English Department. They are very much equal with this outcome.

There was a very interesting show called Orphan Black with identical clones born around the same time as each other. With the best educated, she was working on her PhD and the worst was a high school drop out. The clones never tested brinkmanship dealing with intelligence with each other. In fact, the leader of one faction was Sarah who was a high school dropout. When Sarah was born she had a twin sister, and the two women had different upbringing in different countries, and one with a cult religious upbringing were as Sarah was more or less acting like a atheist. They started out to be violent to each other, stabbing and having shot her twin. Even that they were violent with each other, they bonded with each other because they were violent to each other. Still, it was her twin that was the more violent, as she killed other clones and other people without remorse.

 

[ashleigh]

I’m not stupid because I haven’t finished sixth form yet, I’m stupid because I’m stupid.

This also brings up an interesting point. I never applied for sixth form. Instead I completed a btec diploma which is an a level equivalent, just all course work and no exams. I didn't take this route because I felt I wasn't smart enough pass a levels. I took this route because I was simply tired of exams. It was a decision based on preference, not intelligence. Someone could have the required intelligence to complete a PhD but simply not want to.
I just find the opinion that someone can't be intelligent if they don't have a PhD to be very short sighted. A person can be intelligent about some things but clueless about others. It's not an easy thing to measure and I certainly don't think it can be decided on a person's level of education. What if someone actually is very intelligent but gets nervous during their exams? That doesn't negate their level of intelligence. It simply means they failed an exam.

 

[November]

In real life the differences with education between two identical twins separated apart does have a mild differences. Still, in general most end their formal education at the same level. Even with the wish to become more educated, like reading nonfiction books or reading books that are the cannon books of any university English Department. They are very much equal with this outcome.

There was a very interesting show called Orphan Black with identical clones born around the same time as each other. With the best educated, she was working on her PhD and the worst was a high school drop out. The clones never tested brinkmanship dealing with intelligence with each other. In fact, the leader of one faction was Sarah who was a high school dropout. When Sarah was born she had a twin sister, and the two women had different upbringing in different countries, and one with a cult religious upbringing were as Sarah was more or less acting like a atheist. They started out to be violent to each other, stabbing and having shot her twin. Even that they were violent with each other, they bonded with each other because they were violent to each other. Still, it was her twin that was the more violent, as she killed other clones and other people without remorse.

Ok I think I can follow some of your other trains of thought with this post (which is a relief to be honest). I do agree that the common perception of our society is that if one is intelligent, then they use that intelligence for university studies. To not use that intelligence to make a lot of money (as those within university communities do) is seen as a dumb choice.

Sarah - the high school dropout, with a child, lead the group despite not having certification of her intelligence. Helena learned the value of life and stopped the murdering when she had her own children. Neither had a higher education yet both were successful in their lives by the end. Which sister would you say had the street smarts? And where do "street" smarts or other areas of knowledge fit into the argument that a PhD is the only proof of intelligence? My sister has a PhD, but she could not have kept my rescue rabbit alive like I did, she would not have been able to train horses as I have. The value of her PhD is in the amount of money she made from that choice, not in the skills or enjoyability of life.



PS, I had to autocorrect the word intelligence more than once in this post.

 

[Faith 2019]

As I said on the other thread - I've got a bloody PhD. All it does is validate the intelligence I started out with and testify, to use @Spanky 's words, to my "perseverance, devotion and resources". It didn't teach me how to think - just gave me the language with which to express my thoughts. Yes...I gained "knowledge" but it wasn't knowledge that wasn't available to others - I just read a few books is all. It was hard work...time consuming...it's easy to become obsessed (I did...but I'm obsessive at the best of times). It was also incredibly self indulgent and I (somewhat perversely) enjoyed it. Truth be known, it was easier than looking after kids (I had three kids under five when I started it).

Were I live, I live with three different charter schools going from pre-K to 12, a public middle school, and a charter school that started from being pre-K to K and going to pre-K to 6 grade. And they are less than 2 miles from my home. Number of Americas who do go to college complain about their student loan debts. With the one school that was teaching from pre-K to K, each year the cost is $10,000 so when your child gets into the first grade your already have spent $20,000. But, your child can speak and read in Spanish and English. With the other three charter schools, the average cost per year is around $17.5 thousand dollars a year. If your planning to send your child to college, your already have spent over 1/4 million dollars. These students were not educated to stop at a 4 year degree, they were educated to get a masters or a PhD. In America, if your really budgeting your child to get a PhD, with the cost of the education, the cost to live to be a student, the cost to travel in your goals to have a PhD: you better budget for 1.5 to 2 million dollars.

 

[Skanky Vamp]

if your really budgeting your child to get a PhD, with the cost of the education, the cost to live to be a student, the cost to travel in your goals to have a PhD: you better budget for 1.5 to 2 million dollars.

So, based on this response, when you posited that the procuring of a PhD was a direct correlation to your intelligence maybe it would be more appropriate to state it's proof of how much you are willing to spend to prove your intelligence.

 

[Faith 2019]

Ok I think I can follow some of your other trains of thought with this post (which is a relief to be honest). I do agree that the common perception of our society is that if one is intelligent, then they use that intelligence for university studies. To not use that intelligence to make a lot of money (as those within university communities do) is seen as a dumb choice.

Sarah - the high school dropout, with a child, lead the group despite not having certification of her intelligence. Helena learned the value of life and stopped the murdering when she had her own children. Neither had a higher education yet both were successful in their lives by the end. Which sister would you say had the street smarts? And where do "street" smarts or other areas of knowledge fit into the argument that a PhD is the only proof of intelligence? My sister has a PhD, but she could not have kept my rescue rabbit alive like I did, she would not have been able to train horses as I have. The value of her PhD is in the amount of money she made from that choice, not in the skills or enjoyability of life.

My bias is because I am a reader, and I in general read nonfiction books. When I look at a nonfiction book at the bookstore, I rational think to myself, does the knowledge of the book shows I have a under developed knowledge of the books topic, and if I read the book, will that knowledge improve my daily understanding of society. If yes I am interested with the book with the books topic. Then I look at the author, if the author has a PhD and is also teaching at a important university, then I am more interested with the book. Anyone can be a author, but if your teaching at a university, your fellow equals will be critical of your book for your entire life and even after your death. If the book has 400 pages and more, then I am going to get that book.

With nonfiction books, I have a bias with authors with a PhD, because there book, will always be judge at the university level. True, I could be reading current event books, with a author with a clear mission, and a book with less than 300 pages. But with those books, the reader wants confirmation bias, and the author will give them confirmation bias. With a author with a PhD, I can read the book 20 years or 100 years after it was first published. With current event books, they are a dead letter after a few years. What book should I read at the bookstore, a book that can have interest 10 years or 20 years out of print, or a current event book that becomes pointless when a new American administration takes over the White House.

So yes, I have a bias for someone with a PhD.