Not Fade Away: Did You Like It?

I had mixed feelings about it. First and foremost, I despise the creators of any series that ends its final episode in a cliffhanger, and as far as we knew at the time, that was exactly what had happened. It always leaves me with the feeling that the writers have written themselves into a situation that they can't get out of, so they just leave the whole thing hanging, incomplete. I think that I would have actually preferred everyone dying, since at least that would have been a proper conclusion. Barring that, some sort of "deus ex machina," whether it involved an army of Slayers or direct intervention by the Powers That Be, should have been employed (still a cop out, but at least a CONCLUSIVE cop out)

For the parts that I enjoyed, I knew from the beginning that Angel was leading everyone on a suicide mission, and it was no surprise that characters had to die. That was handled very well. I liked Connor's part in the fight. It was the first time that we had ever seen father and son really fight as a team as opposed to just participating in the same general brawl, and they worked very well together. I would have liked to have seen more of Spike, Illyria, and Gunn's fights, but that would have taken at least another episode, and the little that they did show left no doubt that they got their respective jobs done.

All in all, it was a good episode right up to the last, but if I had written it, just before Angel said, "Lets go to work!" I would have had Faith and a group of very determined and well armed Slayers step out of the shadows (Sarah might not have been available, but I bet Eliza was) and say something memorable, like, "Angel, you've screwed everything up again as usual, but luckily, Spike had the good sense to call us. Now, go take care of Gunn, and let us do our job. If we need a second front, we'll call you."
 
white avenger said:
I had mixed feelings about it. First and foremost, I despise the creators of any series that ends its final episode in a cliffhanger, and as far as we knew at the time, that was exactly what had happened. It always leaves me with the feeling that the writers have written themselves into a situation that they can't get out of, so they just leave the whole thing hanging, incomplete. I think that I would have actually preferred everyone dying, since at least that would have been a proper conclusion. Barring that, some sort of "deus ex machina," whether it involved an army of Slayers or direct intervention by the Powers That Be, should have been employed (still a cop out, but at least a CONCLUSIVE cop out)
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Oh, gosh, I completely agree with this! That was exactly what I thought. You explained things in a much better way than me... well done you with your smart-putting-the-words-together lol
 
I liked it but not Lorne killing Lindsey. That I didn't like at all. It wasn't right to ask Lorne to do that. Angel must have known how it'd affect him. I suppose he had bigger issues to think of it but asking Lorne to do it wasn't right.
 
Thunderduck said:
I liked it but not Lorne killing Lindsey. That I didn't like at all. It wasn't right to ask Lorne to do that. Angel must have known how it'd affect him. I suppose he had bigger issues to think of it but asking Lorne to do it wasn't right.
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It also makes no sense whatsoever when you consider the fact that it reduced Angel's fighting force by 20 % in a time when he really couldn't afford the loss. Even if Lorne HAD read Lindsey and realized that he couldn't be trusted in the long run, it would have made much more sense to kill him AFTER the battle, assuming that any of them survived that long. (But then, no one could really call anything about the direction that Angel was taking them at the end of Season 5 as sensible. Sensible would have been recruiting more soldiers for his little army and making certain that they were better prepared and armed when the time came. If not the Slayers, there was Gwen, what was left of Gunn's old gang, and any of the friendly demons in the area who might be willing to join in.)

It's an almost certain bet that anything Lindsey had planned in the way of a double cross would have taken place after, and if, they survived the battle. Up until then, the safest place that he could possibly be was with Angel and his crew.
 
T
Thunderduck
I agree.
white avenger said:
It also makes no sense whatsoever when you consider the fact that it reduced Angel's fighting force by 20 % in a time when he really couldn't afford the loss. Even if Lorne HAD read Lindsey and realized that he couldn't be trusted in the long run, it would have made much more sense to kill him AFTER the battle, assuming that any of them survived that long. (But then, no one could really call anything about the direction that Angel was taking them at the end of Season 5 as sensible. Sensible would have been recruiting more soldiers for his little army and making certain that they were better prepared and armed when the time came. If not the Slayers, there was Gwen, what was left of Gunn's old gang, and any of the friendly demons in the area who might be willing to join in.)

It's an almost certain bet that anything Lindsey had planned in the way of a double cross would have taken place after, and if, they survived the battle. Up until then, the safest place that he could possibly be was with Angel and his crew.
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As a leader, Angel had to make some tough decisions: sacrifice Connor's memory of him for the sake of his happiness, don't save Fred, ask Lorne to make sure Lindsey didn't survive"¦

And at some stage or other every character had pivotal moments in their journey when they had to make a choice "“ do what's best, not what's easiest "“ and for Lorne, sadly, this happened almost at the very end of his journey. Nobody registered surprise when Lorne told them he would NOT be joining them at the hotel.

It makes utter sense to me that Angel HAD to make sure all potential loose ends were tied up before he faced the ensuing battle. If no-one had survived , who then would have dealt with Lindsey afterwards? Lorne had heard him sing. Enough said. If you trust Lorne as a character then you HAVE to trust his judgement on this one. And as I said, the fact that he even raised the gun told me that it was necessary. Maybe it had to be Lorne who did the deed as he was the only one who could do so in full knowledge of why the trigger had to be pulled.

Plus, I gotta say, I couldn't watch Lindsey without wanting to take a pair of scissors to his his grungy hair"¦
 
I, personally, loved it. I know there has been some debate about it ending on a cliff-hanger, but really, would you want to see another character die?

And, plus, that's what the comics are for!
 
It was gud i like the flip what angel did but that actually kinda it lol but chosen was so much better when buffy nealy died and spike died and anya and when sunnydale went to an innie instead of an outie lol
 
I LOVE nfa. To me it rivals The Gift for the verses saddest ep. Its the total opposite of Chosen. I felt so sad for Wes dying in Freds arms like that, it makes me wish they let him live. And when Lorne tells Angel not to look for him i think its a shame he felt that way, they used to be so close, then you could see the personal anguish in his face when he shot Lindsey. But i loved that underneath

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the sadness of it all there was always hope shining through. The last scene in the ally was just epic.
 
I just saw this episode for the first time a few days ago. Illyria was funny as always, and even though I was devastaed when Fred died, Illyria had become my favorite character soon after. I liked the part when she was Fred, then she punched, and morphed. Damn, that was cool.

Anyways, the ending was a little...cheap. It seemed a little, rushed.

EDIT: Illyria is my favorite character, angel-wise, btw.
 
I liked the ep, but I wished it was longer. I felt they crammed so much into, like, 2 episodes and I didn't think it did the characters justice.
I cried like a baby at the scene where Wes died. I knew I would, and I definitely did, especially when Illyria "lied" to him. Aww... And Poor Gunn. 🙁 We knew he wasn't gonna make it when he showed up and Spike said "The red stuff's supposed to be on the inside". 🙁 The scene between Lorne and Lindsey made me cry, as well... I could feel the pain in Lorne's voice, and I understood why he told Angel not to come looking for him... But bless their hearts for fighting to the bitter end. 🙂
 
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BillyidolwannaB
[No message]
I was a bit disappointed that this felt more like a season finale than a series finale, but it worked. The killing of the Circle of the Black Thorn helped Angel feel that he could eventually win the war against evil, and that evil couldn't beat him down. So, in that sense, it nicely summed up that aspect of the series while offering hope that the good guys would definitely win in the end. But of course it was also nice that Angel was realistic about the matter, and knew that it was possible that none of them would live.

It was nifty that Illyria killed Cyvus Vail as herself and partly as Fred, and I feel this helped justify the dual nature of that character. Although, this action also brings up the question of whether "Fred" or Illyria killed Cyvus Vail, since it's highly possible that Illyria grieved for Wesley (either because she "believed the lie", was influenced by Fred's memories, or some other reason).

I would have liked to see more of each character's battle with members of the Circle of the Black Thorn, and that was the major limitation in trying to cramming all that action into one episode. But I think the filmmaking team did a decent job with a limited timeframe. Plus, it resulted in Angel spiking the baddie's drink, which is more creative than a drawn-out battle (if less impressive). The Angel vs. Hamilton battle was also pretty cool, and ended with another creative kill (specifically, Angel drawing upon Hamilton's power). However, I was disappointed that Harmony exited the show with a betrayal and a request for a referral. She showed signs of redemption in "Harm's Way" and "Shells", but then reverted to "Evil Harmony". Funny and ironic, yes, but still a step backward.
 
Did i like this episode?! If you watch all of angel then watched the last episode how couldnt you love it. i personally cried at the end because of how i was so connected to it... i did not expect those ppl to be there at the end, i mean it was sad when gun made it but he had what.... 10 mins at best right? and he is still ready to fight, simple bliss i think. Illyria grieving for wes, its a big turn around in a certain way. and who could forget about the 2 soulful vamps! they accepted death just to prove a point that they have been fighting for through hmm lets see... the whole angel series...
 
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BillyidolwannaB
Very much agree
It was probably the best end to a show i've ever seen.

I liked how many characters dies they killed off eveyone they could.

"Thats all Folks" is a great line from Lorne.

Fred and Wesley is a genius move.

And the cliffhanger ending is just what was needed to keep people talking about thsi show and wanting more.

One of the most Amazing episodes of TV ever.
 
When ever I think of S1 contrast to S5 I get so sad because no one from the original gang survived well except Angel and technically Gunn.

Illyria's scene with Wesley was amazing! and I loved it when she blasted that wizards face off.
 
I liked it, I was just dissapointed that all of my least favorite characters survived, yet my favorites were killed off. Except for Spike, of course.
 
This eppy was hit and miss for me, plus it seemed more like a season finale.



Wesley was given a great send off, but i hated watching him die.


My take on Lorne killing Lindsey...


For me, it was utimate FU from Angel.

Basically saying how insignificant he was in Angel's mind.

Such as Lindsey didn't even merit him taking the time to carry out the deed himself. In fact, being killed by Lorne bothered Lindsey more than actually dying.

Personally I think the character/actor deserved better, but it was the mother of all GUT PUNCHES from Whedon.
 
Revolver said:
I've enjoyed reading the fresh takes on the shows because I saw them all some time ago. Having seen everything now, what are your final impressions regarding both shows?
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I like both shows overall.

However, if given a choice of which one I prefer more, have to go with Angel. No knock against BTVS, but Angel featured characters that I found more intriguing.

Two of them went thru major tranformations, which landed then on my list of faves.

Particularly Wesley, Alexis Denisof blew me away.

especially in the later seasons.

Now I plan to checkout Firefly.
 
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