Official Discussion of 7.11 "Showtime" (UPN-US)

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But how accurate are the timelines they appear to be giving us? What with some of the abrupt flashbacks, character viewpoints, and different-times-in-different-dimenisions, I think sometimes the point of the show is to confuse us about what's happening when.

Giles and Anya *seemed* to be talking to the Oracle while the FE was posing as Eve, and Xander and Buffy were discovering her dead, but can we safely make that assumption because they weren't around when Eve was? (Or *was* Giles ever in the same room with Eve, maybe early in the episode? Anyone remember?)

Personally, I don't see Giles as the FE on top of everything else. It seems just a bit too complicated, even for Whedon-world.
 
When Rona first arrives at the house, everybody is in the living room. Giles comes in with Anya, and you can clearly see Eve sitting on the floor with Chloe and Vi.

Then, in "Conversations With Dead People", the FE was playing Warren and Cassie at the same time.

So, it is possible for them to be in two places at once; I'm not so sure about being in the same area as two people, but that would pretty much be the same thing. This means Giles could be the FE, but it doesn't mean that he is (which I believe).
 
Originally posted by FiveByFiveB
When Rona first arrives at the house, everybody is in the living room. Giles comes in with Anya, and you can clearly see Eve sitting on the floor with Chloe and Vi.

Then, in "Conversations With Dead People", the FE was playing Warren and Cassie at the same time.

So, it is possible for them to be in two places at once...
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But *was* the FE playing Cassie and Warren at the same time? On the same night, definitely, and before Willow comes home to find Dawn in a state about seeing Joyce, but those conversations could have been fifteen minutes here, half an hour there...

Not that I'm saying the FE *couldn't* necessarily have the power to be in two places at once. (We are talking about the First Evil here. 🙂 I just don't think it's been established as a certainty.
 
It's not certain that he can't be on two places on the same time, but it's not certain he can be on two places on the same time either, I don't know yet, I think they're leaving us in the dark at purpose!
 
speaking of Joyce, I for one would like THAT little loose end tied up! Was it really here and the First was trying to stop her? Or was it the First playing Joyce? And what did she mean by "buffy won't choose you." etc. Just one more thing to remember... we don't know what that was all about yet.
 
Originally posted by Buffy Ann Summers
speaking of Joyce, I for one would like THAT little loose end tied up! Was it really here and the First was trying to stop her? Or was it the First playing Joyce? And what did she mean by "buffy won't choose you." etc. Just one more thing to remember... we don't know what that was all about yet.
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Hmm....GOD that just reminded me of something! Maybe Buffy will have to pass on her slayerness power to stop the FE?! And she wont choose Dawn!

I dunno it just hit me for no reason what so ever 😛

(PS: Yes Im aware I said she dont have that option before and I may be contradicting myself right now 😛)
 
I thought the episode was good, not great, but good. I liked how Buffy kicked the uber-vamp's ass in the end. 😀 I have a few nitpicks though: First of all, the slayers in training just got SO annoying. Kennedy is the only one I like. They were all so whiny and they had no faith in Buffy! And Eve's "southern accent" was just lame. She slipped in and out of out and it sounded stupid.

I thought it moved the story along nicely, but it was a little disappointing since "Bring On the Night" was such a great episode, in my opinion. I especially like Dawn so much more this season! She actually acts her age and does cool stuff like pour water on Andrew. I was cracking up whenever Andrew made funny comments. 🙂
 
I think that Rona is cool!! Either she or Kennedy have a shot at becoming the next slayer. Kennedy really took charge in this ep and it paid off. Rona needs a little more practice and I think that she could possibly be ready. Overall, this ep was great. I can't wait until the next one!!😱 😛
 
actually one question i have is what the heck were jonathan and andrew doing digging up the seal of danzathar in the first place?

--mmmdonuts
 
Originally posted by mmmdonuts
actually one question i have is what the heck were jonathan and andrew doing digging up the seal of danzathar in the first place?

--mmmdonuts
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Jonathan had researched about it and was going to dig it up and then let Buffy and the scoobies know, to redeem himself. Meanwhile Andrew was manipulated by the FE to kill Jonathan once the seal was digged up.
 
New to the board, so this may have been said before, but I don't believe so...

How could Holy Water affect a monster that existed before the religion that gave the water power? The NeanderVamp shouldn't have been hurt. I really liked this episode--a lot--but enemies without defined powers and weaknesses irk me--especially if that kind of vagueness drags on too long.

I think all the trainees are good, or at least have potential. Kennedy is beautiful, but her acting has me concerned at this point. First of all, when she was in the bedroom with Willow, her delivery of the dialogue was EXACTLY the same as Dawn's. Then when she gave that comment to Ronna about how the NeanderVamp could "skip that part and come straight here" (in regard to killing Buffy), I just cringed. It was supposed to come across as cooly delievered, but just seemed terribly akward. She's new, so maybe she'll have time to grow. I think the girl that plays Eve is a fantastic actress, and the evil blonde Southern girl routine, as perfected in the Faculty, was perfect. I hope she sticks around, but probably not. I really like all the new characters, and the thought that some of them might get killed off if the First gets its way might give a big emotional effect. Any one of them dying would make me hugely sad at this point, so I hope they all live. Not one for reading spoilers, this is going to be so exciting as the season plays out, not knowing what will happen. Ronna and Kennedy seem like particular focal points, from the way their characters have been developed. So far, I have to say it's an amazing season.
 
Originally posted by King Kamehameha
New to the board, so this may have been said before, but I don't believe so...

How could Holy Water affect a monster that existed before the religion that gave the water power?
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One could speculate that the water had the power long before Christianity existed; just somewhere along the line the Church learned how to "distill" its essence...
 
It's the faith that the user has in all good that scares the creature of evil ... kinda lame, but I can deal with it!

Kennedy is beautiful, but her acting has me concerned at this point.
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What's wrong with it? btw: maybe the directors wanted to have her do it this way?
 
Her acting is just--it's hard to explain. I guess maybe it's a regional thing. It's like there's a hint of valley girl in there. I really noticed it when she was talking about the wings of her houses. She said something along the lines of..."but not the house in the Hamptons. Well...one...actually. It was so Dawn-ish, even the facial expressions. I'm just sensing that there may be an upper limit to her acting ability, but I hope she proves me wrong. At least she has that innate likeability so important to actors. I guess I should give her more time.

As for the religion thing, I thought Catholics bless water, and that then it becomes holy. I guess the NeanderVamp had existed for all of those centuries, but then when Jesus came along the vamp suddenly became weakened by the spirit of Christianity? I'm not sure--it just seemed weird to me.
 
not only christianity, but any other religion too (excl. Satanism), because of the scaringly strong belief in the upper-good!
 
Alley, I think it has to be Christian Holy Water. No other religion I'm aware of really blesses their water in such a ritualistic way, so I think it may be specific to that religion particularly. If it was just a matter of faith, Willow holding up a cross wouldn't affect the vamps because she has no belief in the Christ--she's Jewish. It would mean, however, that she could hold up the Star of David as an effective ward against vamps, but since that hasn't happened, I have to assume it's about Christianity specifically.
 
Just because the Turok-han came along before the invention or idea of holy water doesn't mean it wouldn't be effective. The possibility of the concept always existed. It's like saying a stake shouldn't work on a vampire because vampires came along before the invention of the stake.
 
Actually a piece of wood with a sharp edge has existed from the beginning of time 😛 ::wave::
 
Well that's exactly what i'm saying. Just because a light bulb wasn't invented from the beginning of time doesn't mean when you combined the elements that create a light bulb that it wouldn't be a light bulb. The potential for someone to bless water was always there, it just didn't happen from the beginning of time. Just like the potential of sharpening a piece of wood and stabbing a vamp with it was always there, someone just had to realize it.
 
My basic point was that NeanderVamp is older than Jesus, and since the religion that gives the Holy Water its power is based on Jesus, I just thought it was weird. That's all--it's really a minor thing.
 
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