Spuffy #6 - General Discussion

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Shall we have some new Questions?

Why not 😀

I've been watching season six so...

Q1. In All the Way Spike and Buffy share this exchange:

SPIKE: Feel like a bit of the rough and tumble?
BUFFY: (shocked) What?
SPIKE: Me ... you...
SPIKE: Patrolling? Hello?
BUFFY: Oh. Uh ... I ... should stay. Maybe tomorrow.
SPIKE: It's not like I don't already have plans. Great Pumpkin's on in twenty. (Exits)
BUFFY: (to herself) So much easier to talk to when he wanted to kill me.

What does Buffy mean by the “so much easier to talk to when he wanted to kill me” line?

Q2. The curtains close on a kiss God knows… What happened next?

Q3. At the end of Tabula Rasa Buffy, sitting at the bar, turns away from Spike and Spike seemingly leaves. Yet when we see them next, Buffy and Spike are kissing... How’d that happen?

Q4. Do you think that Buffy ever really considered a more conventional relationship with Spike?

Q5. Season Six Spike’s propensity for wearing gold chains – cool or creepy?



***Spuffy Show and Tell still welcome too!!***
 
Seaon 6 Questions always interesting 🙂

Q1. What does Buffy mean by the "so much easier to talk to when he wanted to kill me" line?

I think she means that it was a lot easier to know how to interact with Spike then as it was a clear-cut case of good guy vs bad guy. But now its not so clear what their relationship to each other is so its more difficult for Buffy to figure out how to interact with him.

Q2. The curtains close on a kiss God knows"¦ What happened next?

They would have realised they'd got caught up in the moment of the song probably and snapped out of it and quickly gone there separate ways trying to forget what just happened.

Q3. At the end of Tabula Rasa Buffy, sitting at the bar, turns away from Spike and Spike seemingly leaves. Yet when we see them next, Buffy and Spike are kissing... How'd that happen?

Spike probably waited around for a bit and found someone else to talk to, but then Buffy probably saw him there, was a bit jealous, Spike saw this then went over to her and then they started talking...

Q4. Do you think that Buffy ever really considered a more conventional relationship with Spike?

Not during season 6, I don't think, we see in As you Were her realisation that the Spike relationship isn't healthy or sustainable as a normal one. But towards the end of season 7 there maybe are signs of this as a possiblity...

Q5. Season Six Spike's propensity for wearing gold chains "“ cool or creepy?

I hadn't noticed this, but I'm not very good at noticing things like that so not surprised, in general though I'd say some of Spikes fashion decisions in season 6 were more creepy than cool
 
I've been avoiding this thread because I didn't turn in my homework. I have it, but it's on MY computer (which is broken). But I will answer the questions after I finish my Thursday shows.
 
My Answers...

Q1
What does Buffy mean by the “so much easier to talk to when he wanted to kill me” line?

I've always thought the line was a bit weird. This is early season six. She's known that Spike has been in love with her since mind season five. He hasn't wanted to kill her for a looong time now, and one could argue that their friendship (albeit utilitarian) developed most rapidly after Buffy found out that he loved her... So i'm not really sure what to make of the line. It seems kinda out of place. I think that perhaps it points to Buffy's growing awareness of him in that she found it so much easier to talk to him when he wanted to kill her because then, it was all 'snark snark snark' and 'put downs' now they are sort of planning patrols together and she feels a real 'pull' to spend time with him... hmmm not really sure.

Q2. The curtains close on a kiss God knows… What happened next?

I think the magic wore off and they realised they were kissing, Buffy turned tail and ran home. Spike stood there dumbfounded before goign to a pub to have a good strong drink.

Q3. At the end of Tabula Rasa Buffy, sitting at the bar, turns away from Spike and Spike seemingly leaves. Yet when we see them next, Buffy and Spike are kissing... How’d that happen?

This one is harder to explain... I think that Buffy turned her head away in an effort to stay strong and not turn to Spike in her time of need. Spike leaves but then once he's outside he thinks of something he wants to say to Buffy (a cutting remark or an argument for why they should talk about what happened perhaps?) so goes all the way back inside to say it to her face. She tries to walk away, saying she doesn't want to talk to him. He follows. Then perhaps he says something kinda nice that disarms Buffy, like sympathises with her over Giles departure or something like that and thus they end up kissing again.

Q4. Do you think that Buffy ever really considered a more conventional relationship with Spike?

Maybe. In Older and Far Away Buffy says something like "I was crazy to think that you could hang out with my friends..." which might perhaps suggest she'd given some thought to how it might work out if she 'came out' about her relationship with Spike. Maybe.

Q5. Season Six Spike’s propensity for wearing gold chains – cool or creepy?

Creepy! Sorry Spike, love ya but i gotta just say "no" to gold chains!
 
What does Buffy mean by the "so much easier to talk to when he wanted to kill me" line?

Oh I love this line. This speaks volumes to me. I think this is one of the first verbal indications we get that Buffy is feeling something for Spike--certainly physically and perhaps emotionally as well. The line "he was so much easier to talk to when he wanted to kill me" can be applied to their entire Season 6 relationship. She's drawn to him. She wants to be with him. But she doesn't know what those feelings mean; she doesn't even like having them. She doesn't want to be romantically attached to a soulless creature but she finds herself in a situation where said character has made his feelings known to her, and she can't help but feel something as well. The turmoil she's experiencing is significant. Hence, he was much easier to talk to, be around, deal with in general when he wanted to kill her. Back then, she wanted to kill him too. Slayer. Vampire. The rolls were clear and there was no grey area.


Q2. The curtains close on a kiss God knows"¦ What happened next?

I feel pretty confident that Buffy realized she was kissing Spike, tore herself away from him and acted disgusted--just as she had after the first time they slept together. Then she ran away, "virtue fluttering."
Spike went to bed with a grin on his face, knowing he had been right all along!


Q3. At the end of Tabula Rasa Buffy, sitting at the bar, turns away from Spike and Spike seemingly leaves. Yet when we see them next, Buffy and Spike are kissing... How'd that happen?

I imagine that she changes her mind and walks over to him as he's leaving.

Q4. Do you think that Buffy ever really considered a more conventional relationship with Spike?

I honestly believe it had entered her head for sure by Potential; it's the first time she starts to show genuine caring and sympathy for him without the circumstances surrounding Beneath You for example, in which she is pitying him as well. Does that make any sense?
In Season 6, she cared for him, sure. But there were feelings of guilt, anxiety, and superiority tied in as well--in other words, she didn't think of them as equals so she couldn't consider a conventional relationship.
In Season 7, when he comes back ensouled, she feels sympathy for him but more than anything she pities him. Again, they are not on equal footing. If anything, their relationship is more like nurse and patient. This starts to change in Potential. He has a soul, and he's back in the game, helping her out. She can now start to think of him as an equal; as another hero who has her back. The way she shows concern when he is hurt in the early graveyard scene demonstrates this nicely, as does the scene in the bar when they share a knowing grin. Equals. There's relationship potential. (Ooh, maybe that's an intentional second meaning for the title?)

Certainly by "The Killer in Me" when she decides to have his chip removed in order to save his life--she is truly treating him as she would have treated, (and did treat) Angel and Riley. She absolutely acts if she is in a relationship based on trust and respect in this episode.
Is she conscious of all this? I think so. If anything, she probably is by "End of Days."

Q5 Season Six Spike's propensity for wearing gold chains "“ cool or creepy?

Oh so very cool. They look great on him. But I always thought of all the silver jewelry (there's a lot of that too) as a nod to all the traditional folklore in which Vampires are said to be harmed by it. It's sort of Spike's way of saying, "Vampire, wearing sliver. Who's bad? Eff off." And in reality, the silver had no effect on him. Sort of like when a teenager gets a tattoo just to look "bad" or "carefree" when really we all know that tattoos aren't the most dangerous things in the world, lol.
 
Hey fellow Spuffies!!! 😀 Sorry I haven't been around in a while. Life has been crazy busy and is only going to get busier. But, I miss you all!!! 😀

Q1 In All the Way Spike and Buffy share this exchange:

What does Buffy mean by the “so much easier to talk to when he wanted to kill me” line?


I love, love, LOVE this line and even this exchange. Buffy clearly has had thoughts of her relationship with Spike developing into something more than a friendship. She's attracted to him, and we see here that it's a physical and emotional attraction. She's wide eyed, like "Is Spike thinking what I've been thinking too?" She then catches herself when Spike was only referring to patrolling. Of course it was so much easier talking to Spike when he wanted to kill her because she wasn't attracted to him. The focus was on the game of the slayer (good) versus a vampire (evil). But now, I think ever since "Intervention," Buffy is attracted to him. Spike has proven that he can be good, his love for Buffy is genuine, and he's there for her is she needs him. Of course Buffy would be nervous around Spike now that she has feelings for him, which makes it harder for her to talk to him. 🙂

Q2.The curtains close on a kiss God knows… What happened next?

I think after several minutes of making out, lol, the "spell" wore off and Buffy realized exactly what was happening and stopped. She thought about continuing, but got scared and ran off. And we pick up with Buffy and Spike in the graveyard in the next episode, with Spike asking "Can we talk?"

Q3.At the end of Tabula Rasa Buffy, sitting at the bar, turns away from Spike and Spike seemingly leaves. Yet when we see them next, Buffy and Spike are kissing... How’d that happen?

I think Spike went outside to smoke a cigarette, but came back to try and talk to Buffy again. Yet, I don't think Buffy wanted to talk. Not this time, like in "After-Life." So, she brings Spike to a place in the Bronze she thinks is kind of secluded, but not really (I mean come on. Buffy and Spike kiss in public here, lol! She's not really trying to hide her relationship with Spike at this point). I think Buffy is the one who then initiates the kiss. And their connection and attraction for each other is so strong that it turns into another passionate make-out session. Get a room guys, lol!

Q4.Do you think that Buffy ever really considered a more conventional relationship with Spike?

It depends on the season. Maybe not so much in s6, but I think definitely around s7.

Q5. Season Six Spike’s propensity for wearing gold chains – cool or creepy?

Not so much creepy, but not cool IMO. It looks cheap, lol! I prefer Spike with silver jewelry. It matches his blonde hair perfectly! 😀
 
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P
prophecygrrl
*waves* Hiiii!
Tranquillity
Tranquillity
Nice to have you back :) Great answers too.
Q1. In All the Way Spike and Buffy share this exchange:

What does Buffy mean by the “so much easier to talk to when he wanted to kill me” line?

I think she means that she kinda has feelings for him. When he wanted to kill her, it was obvious what she had to do and how she should feel abut him. Now when he's in love with her, it's not.

Q2. The curtains close on a kiss God knows… What happened next?
I think they kissed... and then Buffy ran away. That also sounds consistent with the beginning of Tabula Rasa and Spike's adorable attempt to talk about it.

Q3. At the end of Tabula Rasa Buffy, sitting at the bar, turns away from Spike and Spike seemingly leaves. Yet when we see them next, Buffy and Spike are kissing... How’d that happen?

In my head, it goes like this. Spike is trying to talk to her, she's all "nooo." She's depressed and pissed and tries to take it out on Spike. He walks away thinking "whatever, I'm just trying to help her." Then he stops himself and and says to himself "You know what, I am just trying to help her. And I'm going to try again." So he goes to try again. This time Buffy says "you want to talk? Fine." and takes him back by the stairs where she kisses him. And then BOOM! Makeout session!

Q4. Do you think that Buffy ever really considered a more conventional relationship with Spike?
In season 7, yes, I do. I often view their relationship in season 7 (at least the back half) being an actual conventional relationship they didn't realize was there. Kinda like what happened with my mom and her current husband. They were best friends for two years and then one night they kissed each other goodbye and realized they'd pretty much been in a relationship for 2 years. And I definitely think that if there was a televised Buffy season 8, and Spike survived the fight, they would have been in a more conventional relationship.

Q5. Season Six Spike’s propensity for wearing gold chains – cool or creepy?
I like the gold. I like gold more than silver in general and I thought it was cute/cool/adorable. Of course, I thought the silver was cool/cute/adorable too because I think nearly everything about Spike is cute/cool/adorable... but...
 
Tranquillity
Tranquillity
"Boom! Makeout session" - Great answer!!
Guys! I did my homework!

I don't know if this is the right place for this, but I just learned how to make fanvideos and I've just uploaded my very first Spuffy video on Youtube!

Please watch! I hope you enjoy it! Feedback would be greatly appreciated--I really value the opinions of my fellow Spuffies. 🙂
xo

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CfvMgvWIQu8"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CfvMgvWIQu8[/ame]
 
Tranquillity
Tranquillity
A+++ Well Done:)
S
sisterofmercy
Interesting choice of song, nice :)
K
kittenpoker
wow wow wow! that was really amazing. gave me chills. thanks.
Moscow Watcher
Moscow Watcher
Adorable!
S
StarSlayer
Awww, that was so awesome!!! Loved it!!! :D
Guys! I did my homework!

I don't know if this is the right place for this, but I just learned how to make fanvideos and I've just uploaded my very first Spuffy video on Youtube!

Please watch! I hope you enjoy it! Feedback would be greatly appreciated--I really value the opinions of my fellow Spuffies. 🙂
xo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CfvMgvWIQu8

It's always the place for more Spuffiness!! That's a really cute and great video! I couldn't even tell it was your first vid. I love Mika too. Haven't heard the song in a while, but it's very fitting 😀
 
Guys! I did my homework!

I don't know if this is the right place for this, but I just learned how to make fanvideos and I've just uploaded my very first Spuffy video on Youtube!

Please watch! I hope you enjoy it! Feedback would be greatly appreciated--I really value the opinions of my fellow Spuffies.
xo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CfvMgvWIQu8

Completey right place and Totally awesome video!
So much better than my first attempts at video making - I'm too embarressed to watch my early vids now, but you have made a video to be proud of. Thanks for sharing 🙂
 
Time for some new Spuffy questions...

1. I'm sure we've asked this before but i'm asking it again anyway...Are there any songs that remind you of Spike/Buffy? What are they and why.

2. What, if anything, would make you abandon Spuffy as your shipping preference?

3. How do you think Buffy would react if Spike hooked up with someone else in Season 9?

4. Which of the Scoobies would have helped Buffy deal with Spike's death the most, post-Chosen?

5. And while we're at it, How do you think Buffy found out that Spike was alive again?

Answer any or all 🙂
 
1. I'm sure we've asked this before but i'm asking it again anyway...Are there any songs that remind you of Spike/Buffy? What are they and why.

Maybe not the best one, but...Garbage's [HASHTAG]#1crush[/HASHTAG]. It reminds me of Spike's intense and desperate love for Buffy in S5-6.

2. What, if anything, would make you abandon Spuffy as your shipping preference? If I had a chance with Spike?😀

3. How do you think Buffy would react if Spike hooked up with someone else in Season 9? I think she would be hurt a bit, but would forgive him.

4. Which of the Scoobies would have helped Buffy deal with Spike's death the most, post-Chosen? All of them, a bit. Willow and now Xander both know what it is like to lose a lover to death then...

5. And while we're at it, How do you think Buffy found out that Spike was alive again? I imagine one of the potentials or someone else referencing Spike casually and Buffy being like "what?, huh - recently you saw him?!"
 
Gum Gnome33
Gum Gnome33
Oh wow I totally forgot about #1 crush! I used to listen to that all the time when it came out! It's a perfect Spuffy song!!!
1. I'm sure we've asked this before but i'm asking it again anyway...Are there any songs that remind you of Spike/Buffy? What are they and why.

Creep, Who wants to live forever, Stand by your man; to list a few.

2. What, if anything, would make you abandon Spuffy as your shipping preference?

Suddenly finding myself in the Slayer-verse.

3. How do you think Buffy would react if Spike hooked up with someone else in Season 9?

I think she'd be critical of any woman dating him but I think granted the woman had genuine feelings for Spike; she would be supportive; at least publicly. Privately it would tear her up until she couldn't stand it anymore; causing her and Spike to have a long conversation which ends with even longer frisky love making.

4. Which of the Scoobies would have helped Buffy deal with Spike's death the most, post-Chosen?


Dawn, Wilow, Xander for reasons mentioned.

5. And while we're at it, How do you think Buffy found out that Spike was alive again?

She got the update from the Spike-fan club.
 
I'm tired and should go to sleep, but for some reason I feel like 2 AM is too early to do that. So I think I'll answer these questions. I'll pclrobably come back and write something that makes more sense when I'm more awake... maybe. haha

1. I'm sure we've asked this before but i'm asking it again anyway...Are there any songs that remind you of Spike/Buffy? What are they and why.
There are tons! To name a few:

Innocent by Taylor Swift. It's all about forgiveness and second chances. Spuffy has a lot of those. But seriously, listen to it IS the story of Spuffy.

Dear John by Taylor Swift. I had never thought of this song as a Spuffy song until a couple weeks ago, but then I didn't think of it again until last week when the song was stuck in my head. I played it over and over and eventually I caught myself not thinking of my experience with emotional abuse, but rather Spuffy. It fits the abuse on both sides of the relationship in season 6 so well. (I included this one because it's the one stuck in my head at the moment)

Life Less Ordinary by Carbon Leaf. This song is Spuffy from Spike's side. It's a happy upbeat telling of it... but it is the story from his side. At least season 5.

2. What, if anything, would make you abandon Spuffy as your shipping preference?
Nothing. haha I love Spuffy. They are in my heart. There is nothing anyone could do or say that would change my mind about that.

3. How do you think Buffy would react if Spike hooked up with someone else in Season 9?
I think she'd be very hurt. And it would display as anger... she wouldn't show him she was hurt and be emotionally vulnerable at all... but she'd be very hurt. I think there's kind of an understanding between the two of them that for Spike, it will always be Buffy. And for him to break that... I think that would hurt her a lot. I mean, he did kind of promise she'd always be the one. She'd feel betrayed a little... naturally.

4. Which of the Scoobies would have helped Buffy deal with Spike's death the most, post-Chosen?
Willow. I don't think Dawn really understood Buffy was in love with Spike. Xander wouldn't have accepted she was in love with him. Giles made it clear a few episodes before how he felt about Buffy and Spike. Willow's the only one I can see being particularly comforting.

5. And while we're at it, How do you think Buffy found out that Spike was alive again?
I have no idea. I really hope they explore that a tad in season 9. Although, I really don't think they will. I have a million different scenarios for this in my head... and I can't settle on even a few that seem the most probable. I like the idea of a slayer stationed in LA saw him and told Buffy... then Buffy called Angel and was like "is that true?!" and he was all like "yeah... I would have told you but we didn't know how long he was going to stay" and then that contributed to Buffy not trusting Angel and company really in Damage. But that's one of a million scenarios in my head.
 
1. I'm sure we've asked this before but i'm asking it again anyway...Are there any songs that remind you of Spike/Buffy? What are they and why.

Night of my life by Damien Leith - I've always thought that was the perfect season 7 Spuffy Song: [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SR8zZIo7LIk"]YouTube - ‪Damien Leith - Night Of My Life‬‏[/ame]

2. What, if anything, would make you abandon Spuffy as your shipping preference?
I think if they managed to show Buffy or Spike in a healthy, productive, workable relationship with someone else that made them happy I would probably come to terms that Spuffy's ship had sailed (or been sunk) but I don't think another ship could ever live up to Spuffy for me - it is my all-time-favourite ship and it would be nigh on impossible to change that!

3. How do you think Buffy would react if Spike hooked up with someone else in Season 9?
I don't think she'd like it at all but I think she'd be stoic about it. Man I want these two to have a conversation about their shit!!

4. Which of the Scoobies would have helped Buffy deal with Spike's death the most, post-Chosen?
I don't think any of them would have helped her. I think Buffy would have dealt with it privately and by herself. I don't really think that any of the scoobies or Dawn really understood the nature of Spike and Buffy's connection or the strength of their relationship. I've long argued that part of the reason that Spike was so important to Buffy is because he was separate from the scoobies. He was something that she didn't have to share with the gang, so I don't think she would have shared her grief with them either.

5. And while we're at it, How do you think Buffy found out that Spike was alive again?
I wish it was something cool like finding out via a Slayer dream (like in this story I wrote a while ago) but it was probably something boring like Andrew opening his trap. And I agree with Zobo – I don’t think they’re going to be givine us any further information on this anytime soon.
 
Boy, I missed you guys 🙂

1. I'm sure we've asked this before but i'm asking it again anyway...Are there any songs that remind you of Spike/Buffy? What are they and why.

Well, anything angsty and melodramatic, lol.

Also, "Stripped" by Depeche Mode and anything by Placebo.

2. What, if anything, would make you abandon Spuffy as your shipping preference?

Wow, hard one.

If Buffy, in the end, chose Angel. Why? Because Spike deserves better, and in the end, he's the one I want happy.

Yet, I'd still think they were the most interesting couple on the show by far.

3. How do you think Buffy would react if Spike hooked up with someone else in Season 9?


Jealousy, similar to what we saw in Entropy, although I think she'd be a bit more vocal about it.

4. Which of the Scoobies would have helped Buffy deal with Spike's death the most, post-Chosen?


Dawn. No contest. Dawn admired and loved Spike and understood - better than I think we give her credit for - Buffy's relationship with Spike.

5. And while we're at it, How do you think Buffy found out that Spike was alive again?

I think she heard it though the grapevine, probobly from Andrew.
 
Z
zobothehobo
Spike's the one I want to be happy too. Because he wants it is why I started shipping Spuffy
Now most of you know I love both our soulful vamps; both are interesting characters and I share different parts of my history/personality with them. Angelus was a better monster than Spike; but Spike's a better man than Angel. "If You Can Reach Me" by Spuffy Pr0duction's is my favorite Buffy vid because it demonstrates perfectly the difference in how Spike and Angel handle their love for Buffy.

When ever I go back and do a re-watch (every three months or so) of both series I always get tingles leading up to season five; knowing Spike is going to realize what I suspected since School Hard, and knew for certain since Becoming Part II.

I don't think of him deserving it when trying to explain why Spike is Buffy's rightful guy. The thing that comes to my mind is simply him being hers. Whether Buffy ever fully accepts that or makes the same commitment is unknown; but whether the comics tinker with it or the story never gets a proper sendoff doesn't matter. I know from now until Spike turns to dust that there will never be a woman for him besides Buffy.

Guess what I'm saying is if you know one thing; and you only know of one other thing that completes the first thing; other than a huge headache, doesn't that sound like real love. Not the kind that writers are always shoving in our faces every summer; but the kind we goddess willing might all be lucky enough to find someday.

Happy Shipping Back-Steppers!

P.S. I'm just a few days away from porting my stories from fanfiction.net to my livejournal so expect a report soon. 😉

---------- Post added at 02:36 AM ---------- Previous post was at 01:44 AM ----------

zobothehobo agrees: This post is awesome. I missed you.

As I have missed my fellow Spuffies; just needed a little space since there seemed to be a mini shipper war going on; and I'm tired of trying to make people understand that sometimes, just sometimes; 1 + 1 = 1.

I'm also really trying to get a bunch of stuff in order that I've let lapse. The more in shape I get the closer I get to going away for basic training and once I get back from that I'll have to make preparations for moving to whichever base I get stationed at. I've been trying to maintain a safe distance from message boards cause I could talk about geek stuff all day long. Luckily a new company is managing my hotel so I have internet back at work. Meaning I'm getting paid to post.

😀
 
Z
zobothehobo
This post is awesome. I missed you.
Joan the Vampire Slayer
Joan the Vampire Slayer
That is a fantastic video.
Moscow Watcher
Moscow Watcher
Great post!
Litheran for both; already have some of you on my LJ but feel free to add me. I will give notice though that most of the content is for mature audiences; language, violence and adult situations; the usual. I don't have a beta so I'm fixing any errors before I move stuff over to live journal; also need to update the LJ layout as it's a little clunky for reading.

My real problem is I had an outline for the opus I'm writing; but someone went through the papers in my desk and was a little liberal with the cleaning; so I have to recreate it from scratch after I'm already thirteen chapters in.

I'll stop myself there lest ye think me a wanton attention hussy...which I'm not.

😱
 
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