The Case for "Charmed"

Cohen

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This thread is inspired by discussions in another thread about BTVS influences, but I don't want to derail that thread with what turned out to be a much longer post than originally anticipated. So buckle up folks! Here is why Charmed isn't as bad as people think. And why it happens to be a timeless portrayal of sisters who happen to be witches.

Perhaps Buffy, The Craft and Charmed, were simply influenced by the same things.
Of the big four American supernatural franchises, Buffy/Angel, Supernatural, Evil Dead etc Charmed is unquestionably the weakest because it has the weakest monsters. People need to realise that monsters are among the most important aspects of any good fantasy show. The demons in Charmed had a fairly bland backstory and not as much effort was put into making them as genuinely scary or stunning visually.

That said it's still a classic and I personally think you're being a bit hard on it, but then again I would since I like it LOL.

It's third season is fantastic in particular. Death Takes a Haliwell is amazing and the Cole arc is very well done that year.
The writing on Charmed is just plain horrible. It's not just the demons, it's everything. The characters, the long term threads, the weekly episodic plots... it's just so basic and formulaic yet somehow also nonsensical. I would've been embarrassed turning in a Charmed script as a 5th grade creative writing project.

It had attractive cast members. That's all it had going for it.
It has similar influences though, and if you are grouping together things that have been influenced the same way - and being derivative would automatically result in that! - it does belong. Regarding the stories, monsters and arcs it feels, well, older than when it was published. Like it has been modelled on the kinds of shows that would have been run at least a decade prior.

The intention behind Charmed was to create a family show about three young adult sisters against the backdrop of the supernatural. I would argue season 1 of Charmed, which the creator, Constance Burge, had the biggest hand in shaping, was very well written for a first season show in the 90s. In fact, I don't find it nearly as dated as season 1 of Buffy, though I recognize Buffy premiered 2 years prior. And I will give that Buffy clearly inspired Charmed, as the WB was looking for another supernatural-eque show to match the high ratings of Buffy.

The "Shannen" seasons of the show are for the most part well-written and acted, and Rose's first season was equally well-written. Honestly, the writers did a great job of harnessing the on-set tension between Shannen and Alyssa in season 3 by writing in the Phoebe/Cole relationship and bringing in the tension of one of the sisters having romantic feelings for a demon, and using the natural tension to progress that storyline. Had it not reached a boiling point by the end of the season, with Alyssa giving an ultimatum, I think that could have carried well into an alternate season 4.

But even when the concept of the show was shattered with the execs pulling the plug on Shannen (disgustingly after she directed 2 episodes of the season, including (unbeknownst to her) her own death scene and then feeding rumors that it was Shannen who asked to leave), they did a great job of writing in Rose and using the tension between Holly (who also wanted to leave after Shan was fired) and Rose to feed into Piper's reservations about getting close to Paige, was also great.

But Connie still was able to have some influence in these seasons, 1-4. When Brad took over full time in season 5, Holly tried steering the ship as best as she could as a producer, but Brad had his own agendas, specifically putting Alyssa in the least amount of clothing as possible, which began with the Mermaid costume in the season 5 premiere and continued until the three leads wrote in their season 8 contract to not be in costumes anymore.
Also, I think it's important to note that for the first 2 seasons, Aaron Spelling was heavily involved in the look and direction of the show, which he saw as a new generation of Charlie's Angels, and tried to emulate the formula of that show with Charmed. This is why for the entire first season, each girl has their own particular look that doesn't change much. Holly comments on this a lot in the Charmed rewatch podcast.

Now, I will say the show became a campy mess after season 4, and most of the last 3 seasons are difficult to watch because of it. To some of your points, there wasn't a "writers playbook" like Joss had for Buffy. Joss mapped out seasons 2-5 of Buffy before production on season 2 began. He knew where it was heading 4 years down the line, which is why the storytelling is so tight. Similarly with Supernatural, Kripke mapped out 3 seasons, and then expanded to 2 more after the season 2 pickup, and they held pretty firm to this bible. Though initially the Angels thing wasn't going to be in it, as stated in Supernatural Magazine during season 1. My point here is, there was a trajectory of these series from the creator and show runner.

Connie didn't have full reigns of the show like her male counterparts on Buffy and Supernatural. She was constantly competing and butting heads with Brad Kern, which is why we get episodes like "She's a Man, Baby, a Man!" where the girls are fighting a succubus and Alyssa is rubbing ice all over her--body. Brad only cared about making a buck and getting the girls out of their clothes. Connie cared about the story. And eventually, she had enough of the issues and left for other opportunities. And the direction clearly suffered after that.

But there were a few episodes in seasons 1-4 that were very well executed.
  • "Dead Man Dating" (season 1, episode 4) was a well-written episode that explored Chinese culture surrounding death, and included one of John Cho's very first guest starring roles.
  • "P3 H2O" (season 2, episode 8) is an excellent exploration of grief and psychological cycles, as Prue deals with reaching an age her mother was when she died, and visiting the scene of her mother's death, followed by the aforementioned "Death Takes a Halliwell" (Season 3, episode 16) where Prue continues to wrestle with her feelings of grief over death, as she, herself, is placed on Death's "list" (eerily foreshadowing her own death weeks later, though it wasn't initially written that way).
  • "The Witch is Back" (season 1, episode 9) explores the mythology and history of the Halliwell/Warren line when the girls must bring their ancestor, Melinda Warren, to the present to deal with a warlock she banished 400 years prior, and the changes in technology between then and now.
  • "Morality Bites" (season 2, episode 2) presents a moral and philosophical delimma where small actions of using their powers to punish can lead to bigger ramifications later (what starts out as the girls punishing a dog walker who allows their dog to deficate on their sidewalk by Prue using telekinesis to make the man step in his dog's poop eventually leads to Phoebe ten years later punishing an alleged murderer and baseball start by murdering him with her powers, inciting a 21st century Witch Trial).
  • The concept of using powers for "personal gain" is a theme that's explored throughout the series. Too many episodes to list.
  • "Murphy's Luck" (season 2, episode 16) deals with Prue's grief and depression over losing her boyfriend, Andy, in the season 1 finale, as caused by a Dark Lighter. Guest star Amy Adams (Cousin Beth) has an emotional scene where she contemplates suicide at the beginning of the episode, and really shows her talent for acting before she became a big name.
  • The sisters have to travel back to Colonial times in "All Halliwell's Eve" (season 3, episode 4) to unknowingly save their ancestor, Melinda Warren, from an evil witch, keeping their timeline in tact; while their allies face two previously vanquished demons who have come back for revenge on Halloween.
  • "The Good, the Bad, and the Cursed" (season 3, episode 14) makes social commentary about the racism Native Americans faced in the Wild West, and brings to light some of the atrocities made against Native Americans during the 19th century
  • "Pre-Witched" (season 3, episode 17) which explores the backstory of events leading up to the series premiere (though with awful wigs, due to the actresses' change in style from 2.5 years prior). At the same time, Piper and Leo wrestle with the decision to move out of the house to start their own family, following their wedding.
  • "Charmed Again" (season 4 premiere) is a powerful double-episode that seeks to both allow fans to grieve over the loss of one of the three main characters, while also moving the story along by introducing a long-lost sister--that actually works well, given the previous history mentioned in the show (the new sister, Paige, was a product of a previously established affair by the girls' mother and her white-lighter (witch guardian angel) and was hidden due to another previously established "no romance" rule between witches and their whitelighters, which was a driving plot of season 3)
  • "Hell Hath No Fury" (season 4, episode 3) further dives into Piper's depression and anger over the death of her sister, Prue
  • "Brain Drain" (season 4, episode 7) had a plot similar to "Normal Again," but was written and produced 6 months before, where Piper suffers an evil-induced coma where she is in a mental institution so that the Source can extract a spell from her mind that would release the girls' powers (previously used in season 1, episode 10)
  • "Black as Cole" (season 4, episode 8) dealt with the ramifications of Cole's past as an evil demon, as he has become fully integrated into the family as a "good" demon; where he comes face-to-face with the widower of a man he killed previously as Balthazar.
  • "Charmed and Dangerous" (season 4, episode 13) where the season's initial Big Bad (the Source) is vanquished, but threads are left lingering for the final season arc, where Cole becomes the Source and the main Big Bad of the season.
  • "Long Live the Queen" (season 4, episode 20) has Phoebe accepting her role as the Queen of the Underworld, where she is carrying the Source's child, but dealing with conflicting emotions as she's turned against her sisters, but still feels the pull to be good and protect the innocent. Ultimately, she has to make the decision to either kill Cole or kill her sisters as his Queen.
The first 4 seasons of this show are solid television. Yes, there are occasionally some out-there episodes, but we all know that Buffy had some out-there episodes, as well. I would say Charmed season 4 holds up strong to some of Buffy's worst seasons.

As previously mentioned, all of this goes off the rails in season 5, when Brad Kern fully took over the show, and the storylines suffered tremendously, both out of network direction (the network didn't want the serialized episodes like season 4 became, though they garnered the best ratings) and out of Kern's weird fetish of putting the girls in the most revealing outfits, leading to some of the worst storylines, scenarios and episodes. After that point, if you don't lean into the camp, you just have to take yourself out of the show, and I get that.

But seasons 1-4 are very well written, directed and acted.
 
I absolutely agree with every word here. S1-4 we're the best, no question. I loved Paige's introduction (though I was one of those people who swore to stop watching after Shannen got canned).

The Good, The Bad, and the Cursed is DEFINITELY one of my favourites, mainly because of Julian and Shannen's chemistry. They were dating at the time, so that might've explained it. So cute together! 💕
 
Cohen
Cohen
Shannen's directing in that was SO good!
Shannen's directing in that was SO good!

As I recall, Phoebe suffered quite a bit (because of her "connection" to Bo).and nearly died from that gunshot wound.

I wonder how many times Shannen yelled "cut!" while Alyssa was doing those scenes? 😄

God, I LOVE looking at Julian and Shannen!!

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Prue and Paige are the best sisters, then Piper and Phoebe imo.
Piper is my #1.
1- piper
2 - prue
3 - paige
4 - Phoebe

Piper went through the most growth throughout the series. I love how Holly can go from Comedy to drama in an instant. She went from this timid middle sister to a confident oldest.
 
I am currently watching Charmed for the first time; partway through season two now. Before that, I had only seen two seasons of the remake, none of the original, and season two of that was better than season one. The original on the whole seems better overall.
 
I am currently watching Charmed for the first time; partway through season two now. Before that, I had only seen two seasons of the remake, none of the original, and season two of that was better than season one. The original on the whole seems better overall.
Charmed (classic):
I feel like the girls are fully their characters by season 2. There were definitely some growing pains in season 1, but by season 2, the girls had established who each sister was, and the role they played in the dynamic of their family. I wish I could go back and watch with fresh eyes! I'm not usually a "shipper," as romantic aspects of shows aren't really interesting to me, but I really like how Prue and Piper were going on double dates with their boyfriends in season 2. That's the kind of thing that real sisters do with each other. This was a fun dynamic in season 2. There were some great situations that came about because of the boyfriends. Which episode are you on?

Charmed (reboot):
I watched most of the series. I haven't finished season 4 yet.
The writing and acting are all over the place. Especially Melanie Diaz. She tries really hard, but her delivery is missing an authentic piece that I feel is needed. She takes me out of the suspension of belief often. I also think this about Madelaine Mantock. I think Sarah Jeffries was the strongest out of the original reboot trio. I watched it as it aired. I haven't gone back and done a rewatch. I remember liking the season 1 episodes more than the season 2 and 3 episodes.

The issue with the reboot is that it didn't have a solid direction. Every season there was a showrunner change (I think season 1 went through 2 before the series premiered and then the showrunner was replaced towards the end). The second season location change was a... choice. And then they didn't even use Seattle as a good location. I felt there was so much more they could have done there. Most of the series is spent in the SafeSpace and underground bunker after season 2. But I will say the direction it had going for it in season 4 was loads better than the previous 2 seasons, and had there been a season 5, I think that it would have been on a similar playing field as seasons 3/4 of the original. One of the reasons was they got rid of the Abby character introduced in season 2. Abby stole screentime and storylines from the main girls. Similar to Buffy's final season, and Charmed's final season.

Lucy Barrett as Kaela also brought a more authentic feel to the show. She was more grounded in her acting than Madeleine. This is often the issue I have with newer shows created for a young adult demographic--the acting is just not the same caliber as it was in the 90s/00s. I don't know if it's because there are SO MANY projects out there now, that nearly anyone can get an acting gig, but the acting pool of younger millenials and Gen Z just do not compare to elder millenials and Gen X at the same age.

If we were to compare the worst episodes of Classic Charmed to the best episodes of Reboot Charmed, Classic Charmed still wins. And that's on the acting. Shannen, Holly, Rose and Alyssa were so much better as actors than Mads, Melanie, Sarah and Lucy were at around similar ages. But I also think that's because the original trio were all on hit tv shows prior to being cast on Charmed, so they were more seasoned. Sarah Jeffries was on some pre-teen shows, but and Madelaine was on an ensemble one-season show, but other than that, the girls weren't on major projects, so their skills weren't as well developed. The original charmed stars are just more believable in their roles than the reboot stars, because they were better actors.

In all honestly, the reboot was so different than the original, it should have been renamed and called something different. The powers didn't work the same, the mythology was completely different, and the showrunners' differing directions just made it feel disjointed. It wasn't "Charmed," but a far distant cousin.
 
In all honestly, the reboot was so different than the original, it should have been renamed and called something different. The powers didn't work the same, the mythology was completely different, and the showrunners' differing directions just made it feel disjointed. It wasn't "Charmed," but a far distant cousin.

This is hardly uncommon, sadly. It is basically using an existing franchise to try and sell something different. Which has a tendency not to work. But you have to wonder if the shows this is done with would ever be made if this wasn't done. It generally doesn't benefit them in any other way, though.
 
Oh to dream that they could’ve kept Charmed about the sisterhood, as in s 1-3, rather than what it became…

I love re-watching those seasons.

Not to mention that the show pulled off the incredible feat of losing a main character (Prue), and somehow successfully introducing a new, different, but equally terrific character… That is quite something.

The first half of s4 is great! Largely because of Paige. Seriously, they did such a good job introducing her.
Then it quickly begins to suck, primarily because of Phoebe. Which doesn’t end for the rest of the series, sadly

I wonder how it would have gone if the actresses hadn’t nixed the Cole falls for Paige plotline. That could’ve been interesting.


Piper is my #1.
1- piper
2 - prue
3 - paige
4 - Phoebe

Piper went through the most growth throughout the series. I love how Holly can go from Comedy to drama in an instant. She went from this timid middle sister to a confident oldest.

I would say that I love Piper the most in season 1, she is still good in 2-4, definite second favorite, but the Leo stuff drags her down. It becomes her main character trait that she is in a relationship and I don’t know, just feels like wasted potential. (This is however colored by how they become just a terrible couple later, so it isn’t as nice to see the beginning on re-watch)

Seasons 5+ though… honestly do you like her?

The lather, rinse repeat arguments with Leo…
The absolut insanity of having a character simultaneously wanting and whining about a ”normal” life, while refusing to bind her extremely magical child’s powers…

She just turns into a shrieking, bitter, mess that is mostly there to 1) complain about magic, 2) scream Leo, 3) puff up Phoebe’s already giant ego


In hindsight, with more interviews and information being available, I honestly just think Holly didn’t want to be there and stopped caring about the character. She is mad she is there and she lets it show. Fair enough, but makes for terrible tv.
 
I wonder how it would have gone if the actresses hadn’t nixed the Cole falls for Paige plotline. That could’ve been interesting.
If Julian hadn’t landed that Nip/Tuck deal, I wonder how Cole would have advanced. There was still a ton of potential.

I would say that I love Piper the most in season 1, she is still good in 2-4, definite second favorite, but the Leo stuff drags her down. It becomes her main character trait that she is in a relationship and I don’t know, just feels like wasted potential. (This is however colored by how they become just a terrible couple later, so it isn’t as nice to see the beginning on re-watch)

Seasons 5+ though… honestly do you like her?
Her storylines got a bit repetitive, but I think she’s the strongest actress of the 3. I don’t think Brad knew what to do with her character once she was a married mother. It was really 6-8 that was her downhill. And her obsession with saving Leo in season 8 was annoying.
In hindsight, with more interviews and information being available, I honestly just think Holly didn’t want to be there and stopped caring about the character. She is mad she is there and she lets it show. Fair enough, but makes for terrible tv.
Holly gave everything she could on that show. She would watch daily’s and push the cast and crew to do better. She butt heads with Brad a lot. But ultimately, she had to follow the scripts. She wanted the legacy Shannen started to be finished decently.

Brad’s hard on for Alyssa is what ruined the quality of the show. Alyssa could do no wrong, and he wanted her in as little clothing as possible. It was sick.
 
I liked the way Prue's death changed the dynamics, I'm a youngest sister and I only have one older sister, always wished we had another so we could be like the Charmed sisters. But after Prue's death Piper started acting like the oldest sister and at first she fought with Paige and Phoebe became the middle child who broke the fights up. I also like that although they accepted Paige as their sister, Piper and Phoebe were always closer to each other because they grew up together.
 
I find it amazing that Prue was the lead actor in the pilot yet as soon as Phoebe's actor joined the show, she wanted to be the lead character. With the three girls in the pilot a case could be found to encompass them. Even with Phoebe being in series 1, 2 and 3 the prospect of them getting a case for the show was buggered as there was no prospect of getting a case for the show.
I won't even make a comment about how crap I thought the series reboot was. Maybe a coffin was better than a case.
 
I love Charmed because it isn’t deep in the way Buffy is. The writing in my opinion doesn’t suffer until Alyssa got control of Pboebe’s character but it’s still a fun lighthearted show ultimately about sisters and I’ll always love it.
 
I wonder how the show would have progressed in its original form, without Alyssa Milano. It wouldn't have had the on problems caused by Alyssa, enabling Prue to promote sisterly love.
 
I suspect that's really what the problem is with "Charmed." Both A. Spelling and the WB wanted "Charlie's Angels x Bewitched," and based on those terms of reference, it succeeded. It only fails when you expect it to be Buffy with more witches, or the L-Word with Neo-pagans, or a serious attempt at an urban fantasy with hard magic. It always had higher ratings than Buffy, and it lasted longer than Buffy. I think Buffy did what it was trying to do better, but I don't think the two shows are comparable.
 
I love Charmed because it isn’t deep in the way Buffy is. The writing in my opinion doesn’t suffer until Alyssa got control of Pboebe’s character but it’s still a fun lighthearted show ultimately about sisters and I’ll always love it.
I think that's a good point. Everything isn't a metaphor for something. It's a family show about sisters fighting the supernatural. But it isn't meant to be this profound story. It's meant to be enjoyed.

There are still some episodes that are enjoyable beyond season 4. But it's clear that when Alyssa became a producer in season 5, there was a shift in Phoebe's character, making the show suffer. She's much more selfish from the first scene in the season 5 premiere, where she cares more about the new billboard that shows her face all over San Francisco than her sister getting ready to have a baby. Her entire storyline in the first half of the season is about moving on from Cole and being successful at the paper. Gone is her drive to protect innocents. Some career-centered storylines occurred at the tail end of season 4, but not to the extent shown in season 5.

Interestingly, Paige gives up her career to lean into her witchy heritage. She fought for the lead social worker position all of season 4 and finally gets it in the premiere, to give it up so she can focus on protecting innocents. She then spends the next 4 years trying to figure out how she can fit her drive to be a good witch in line with the need for a career.


I wonder how the show would have progressed in its original form, without Alyssa Milano. It wouldn't have had the on problems caused by Alyssa, enabling Prue to promote sisterly love.
Lori Rom was so different. There's a version of her pilot floating around somewhere. I need to go back and see what it was like. Phoebe wouldn't have been as comedic, and maybe that would have done well for the show.
 
What really hurt Charmed, for me, was the departure of Constance M Burge. Oh and Alyssa and Holly becoming producers. I agree that was a mistake.

They both suck season 5 and on (sorry not sorry, I just can’t believe Holly is putting any real effort in), but at least if Constance had remained there might have been more focus on the witchy sisterhood. The power of three and rules of no personal gain all but faded and disappeared after she left. And it is sad, as it was originally her idea, and without her the sisterhood seems more like a hostage situation between people that can barely tolerate each other 70% of the time.

They become so disconnected, and a big part of that is Phoebe’s grand fantasy life where she becomes a celebrity because of her column, keeps moving to luxury sets (whether Cole’s apartment, Jason’s, or that artist guy and later her own condo…) it just becomes clear that showing that Phoebe is amazing and crazy successful (at her first real job btw) is some kind of wish fullfillment for either actress or audience, but it completely forgets what made Phoebe a compelling and interesting character to begin with.

They tried to make her Prue (whose initial career also made little sense considering her age), but forgot there was a reason why they shifted Prue away from Bucklands - having a character constantly complaining about work is BORING. At least with season 1-2 Prue that a responsibility focus suited her character. Phoebe never acts like a responsible adult about her job though, it is simply away to have her complain loudly at others.

It honestly makes it clear that most Charmed writers at the point probably never had an office job, because they have no idea what to write about work except ”look I’m so busy, I’ve got so much work to do”

Also, at least Bucklands served as a way to introduce mysterious objects and innocents. Phoebe’s column is just ego stroking and the occasional guy turned to a turkey.


Look, I never needed Charmed to be super deep, the first three seasons are great because they are brain popcorn with easy fixes and the occasional deep episode thrown in.

The problem is that the main characters become so unlikeable that I actually want them to be vanquished (by Billie and her sister) for a new generation to take over. Everything that Charmed originally was (fun, light, heartwarming) it ceased to be. Everything it wasn’t (smart, good quality, consistent) it never became.

If Constance had remained at the helm instead of Brad Kerns, there would have been hope for the characters.

Though perhaps there is ju a curse on the series as, if I recall correctly, the reboot also lost one of the main actresses by its third season and had to introduce a fourth sister…

Oh well, if they wanted to do another Charmed reboot I would give it a chance too, because I still love the premise
 
Also, at least Bucklands served as a way to introduce mysterious objects and innocents. Phoebe’s column is just ego stroking and the occasional guy turned to a turkey.
That’s a good point, and is missing from the second half of season 2 and season 3. They really could have used Prue’s job at Buckland’s (or another museum, like she started at) to keep introducing new mythology. This was lost when Prue suddenly wanted to become a photographer. She also lost some of her drive as a career woman. But also by 30, many people feel stuck in their career and look for more enriching avenues, so I get it.

Look, I never needed Charmed to be super deep, the first three seasons are great because they are brain popcorn with easy fixes and the occasional deep episode thrown in.


The problem is that the main characters become so unlikeable that I actually want them to be vanquished (by Billie and her sister) for a new generation to take over. Everything that Charmed originally was (fun, light, heartwarming) it ceased to be. Everything it wasn’t (smart, good quality, consistent) it never became.

If Constance had remained at the helm instead of Brad Kerns, there would have been hope for the characters.
I agree. Connie leaving was the final straw. She kept the show about the sisters who happen to be witches aspect. She also had great ideas about the mythology. She came up with the white lighters and dark lighters angle. She also developed what warlocks were. Nothing new and inventive came after she left. It was all just recycling or storylines but somehow worse.
Though perhaps there is ju a curse on the series as, if I recall correctly, the reboot also lost one of the main actresses by its third season and had to introduce a fourth sister…

Oh well, if they wanted to do another Charmed reboot I would give it a chance too, because I still love the premise
The reboot suffered from terrible showrunners in its second and third seasons, which is why Madeline Mantock left. They brought in a fourth witch/demon (which Madeline’s character already was) and gave the more interesting storylines to this fourth actress, when the show was supposed to be about the three sisters. She was tired of playing second fiddle to someone who was 5th on the call sheet, so she bounced when Covid gave her an out. Which, I can’t blame her. I’m halfway through the first season on my rewatch, and it’s actually compelling. But I remember how sluggish the second and third seasons were. So I wonder how I’ll feel about them on the rewatch.
 
A lot of people on this forum complain about how Season 7 of Buffy depended on a medallion and a scythe to achieve a deus ex machina success at stopping the First. But Charmed was full of this type of thing. The sisters would be beset by problems and in the final ten minutes of the show, they would gather in the attic and open the old grimoire and find a spell that would expel the demon causing a problem, often while the demon was flying around the attic endangering them and trying to get them to stop. Every episode had this kind of deus ex machina ending where the sisters would use a spell that someone else had written to solve a problem they didn't know how to solve in any other way. If they had episodes with them inventing spells, that would have given them a degree of competence that would have engendered respect, but they never did that. They just followed the formula.
 
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