Was a new Slayer called when Buffy died at the end of season 5?

And of course unless Joss says flat out one or the other how the slayer line is passed we can pick away at the support with "what ifs", and "maybes".

It is possible to support the "altered slayer line" theory in Season 7 though, and it can be done contrary to what slayerpower suggests with more than one statement. Now try to support the "only through Faith" theory in Season 7. This is something the "only through Faith", people are reluctant to do.

I will argue with the idea the way the slayer line is passed in Chosen does not constitute a change in the "one slayer, and only through Faith" rule. That much is black and white. It does.
 
Why would Buffy being resurrected have any affect on the slayer line? She stopped being the slayer when Kendra was called. A slayer is activated when the previous one dies. The line ran though Faith. Nothing happened to Faith, something happened to Buffy who was not in the line anymore.

You can argue that Buffy was reactivated...somehow... by Willow's spell, never explained, confirmed, impossible to rationalize because it makes no sense.

I think the line probably did run through Buffy, and she alone. But it is horrible story telling if it did.

Ok. Here's a theory.

Why did the First try kill Faith but not Buffy?

When an active slayer dies, a whole new set of potentials comes into being. If you kill the active slayer, then a new large group of potentials appears that you have to hunt down.

That's all I got.

Seriously, you have to be a complete moron to understand season 7. Those of us who live in the land of logic and good storytelling get bogged down by the huge holes in the plot.
 
Well, I believe (its only a belief, Im arguing nothing!) that the line goes through Faith. Like whatshisname up there said, nothing happened to Faith so she should still be the slayer.

But now Im confusing myself trying to explain why The First would try to kill Faith. And Im not awake or well enough to try. I really have no idea that currently makes sense.
 
Wicked said:
Well, I believe (its only a belief, Im arguing nothing!) that the line goes through Faith. Like whatshisname up there said, nothing happened to Faith so she should still be the slayer.
Click to expand...
I am so not getting into this discussion again, but I always feel sorry for Faith when discussing this. Now, I don't know if she actually wants to be
the slayer, I doubt that it matters half as much to her as it does to Buffy, but it's still so not fair that the slayer-line-slayer thing is taken away from her just 'cause Buffy happens to die and be brought back again. (Since that is my belief.)

Grr, all Willow's fault (j/k)...

(Just realised this is not one of those threads where you should just show up, post one post about nothing, then disappear... Ah well.. 😉 )
 
Thats why I said its just my belief. I so dont want to argue it. Ive seen the rest of this thread and apparently theres another one somewhere 🙂 Im staying out of it 🙂
 
Wicked said:
Well, I believe (its only a belief, Im arguing nothing!) that the line goes through Faith. Like whatshisname up there said, nothing happened to Faith so she should still be the slayer.
Click to expand...

Whatshisname? Are you referring to me? What makes you think you can fail to address me with such a dismissive manner?!

I am the thing darkness hides, the never ending torment, the fears you only speak of in the light of day. Pure, transcendent of evil, beyond pain, a void even to darkness. With one vibration I cause the anguish of a billion souls, despair is my servant. Torture a plaything, hatred a tool. I create the sins that the city sleeps to hide. Eternal, forever, infinite. I am"¦ hungry. Burger king, McDonalds, damn the choice is too difficult!
 
Hahaha, yes you. I have no idea what your name is and have no desire to attempt to spell it so you shall now be referred to as Whatshisname. Got a problem with it? We live in the same city, come sort it out 😛
 
Dzhugashvili said:
Why would Buffy being resurrected have any affect on the slayer line?
Click to expand...

Here's a possibillity. A central theme throughout BTVS is there are consequences to witchcraft. You can apply any kind of metaphorical template to that you want, but basically "It's about power". In fact Season 7 tells us this throughout it's run. So couldn't Season 7 be telling us once more, mess with the power, and there will be consequences.

Ok now, remember this one.

What if you could have that power...now? In every generation, one slayer is born... because a bunch of men who died thousands of years ago made up that rule. They were powerful men. This woman (points to Willow) is more powerful than all of them combined. (Willow whimpers) So I say we change the rule. I say my power......should be our power.
Click to expand...

This passage says some interesting stuff. It tells us the model whereby "the line can only be passed through one slayer, and that must be the last slayer in the line" is an artificial construct and can be changed. It also tells us Willow is powerful enough to change that construct. Was she powerful enough at the time of The Bargaining? Did she change it once before unknowingly as a consequence of messing with the magic? Giles, Anya and Beljoxa's eye say she "disrupted the slayer line".
 
But there you go again isolating one small section of the support for the theory as if it is the only layer of support. As you've seen, it is not.

Buffy, The First Evil, Dawn, the Scoobs, and the Potentials all appear to believe the line now passes through Buffy. Assuming they are correct this could be described as a "disruption in the Slayer Line".
 
nerd4hire said:
Here's a possibillity. A central theme throughout BTVS is there are consequences to witchcraft. You can apply any kind of metaphorical template to that you want, but basically "It's about power". In fact Season 7 tells us this throughout it's run. So couldn't Season 7 be telling us once more, mess with the power, and there will be consequences.

Ok now, remember this one.



This passage says some interesting stuff. It tells us the model whereby "the line can only be passed through one slayer, and that must be the last slayer in the line" is an artificial construct and can be changed. It also tells us Willow is powerful enough to change that construct. Was she powerful enough at the time of The Bargaining? Did she change it once before unknowingly as a consequence of messing with the magic? Giles, Anya and Beljoxa's eye say she "disrupted the slayer line".
Click to expand...

To me this invalidates what Beljoxa'a eye said. If I bash your brains in🙄, and you die, is the problem that you are mortal or is it that I bashed your brains in?

If Willow caused the disruption, then Beljoxa's eye is falsely claiming that it was Buffy.


nerd4hire said:
But there you go again isolating one small section of the support for the theory as if it is the only layer of support. As you've seen, it is not.

Buffy, The First Evil, Dawn, the Scoobs, and the Potentials all appear to believe the line now passes through Buffy. Assuming they are correct this could be described as a "disruption in the Slayer Line".
Click to expand...

With the information you're presenting, I think its important to establish when these people said these things. If its before Giles and Anya meet Botoxa's eye, then we know they have no evidence at this point, and its just an assumption. If its after, then we can rationalize that they came to that conclusion based on what they know from the eye. Its been so long since I last watched Buffy I dont really remember the order of events of season 7.
 
I don't actually understand your first complaint, but I'll try to respond to it by describing the way I see the slayer Line/disruption thing.

The passing of the slayer line is a long, continuous operation. There are other ways to see this, but based on Get It Done I see it as a release of power from an existing natural source. The source of demon power. External restrictions have been applied to the way this power is released in a way that it can only be passed from a slayer to a potential slayer at the point of the slayer's death.

Buffy died. Her body rotted. Willow does something different than simply resuscitating an existing slayer the way Xander did in Prophecy Girl. She in a sense created a new being, and inserted it into the slayer line. This corrupts the external regulations placed on the line by the Shadow Men - "a disruption in the slayer-line".

Also, it makes sense something like this would happen, because we know in the Buffyverse there are consequences when magic is used to corrupt an existing order of things.

On the second thing: Dawn says the line passes through Buffy in Potential. Willow, Anya, and Xander implicitly agree by not challenging the statement. The First Evil says the line passes through Buffy in Chosen.
 
nerd4hire said:
I don't actually understand your first complaint, but I'll try to respond to it by describing the way I see the slayer Line/disruption thing.

The passing of the slayer line is a long, continuous operation. There are other ways to see this, but based on Get It Done I see it as a release of power from an existing natural source. The source of demon power. External restrictions have been applied to the way this power is released in a way that it can only be passed from a slayer to a potential slayer at the point of the slayer's death.

Buffy died. Her body rotted. Willow does something different than simply resuscitating an existing slayer the way Xander did in Prophecy Girl. She in a sense created a new being, and inserted it into the slayer line. This corrupts the external regulations placed on the line by the Shadow Men - "a disruption in the slayer-line".

Also, it makes sense something like this would happen, because we know in the Buffyverse there are consequences when magic is used to corrupt an existing order of things.

On the second thing: Dawn says the line passes through Buffy in Potential. Willow, Anya, and Xander implicitly agree by not challenging the statement. The First Evil says the line passes through Buffy in Chosen.
Click to expand...

Are you still banging that 'Get it Done' drum. I prefer an evolutionary process over divinity.

GILES: It's not because she died. The Beljoxa's Eye was quite clear about that in its enigmatic way. It's because she lives. Again. Buffy's not responsible for that.

You're saying it is not because she lives, its something about the magic Willow did. A subtle difference, but its there. Willow does the spell in Chosen that creates all the lines, therefore her magic created the disruption of the line into two. Beljoxa'e eye thinks its simply a case of Buffy being alive, again.
The point was connecting Chosen Willow to Magic resurrect mojo Willow shouldn't win you any cookies. It is not a valid point.
 
Dzhugashvili said:
Are you still banging that 'Get it Done' drum.
Click to expand...

Yeah. I'm weird that way. I prefer to base my "script" assumptions on the scripts.

You're saying it is not because she lives, its something about the magic Willow did.
Click to expand...

No I'm saying it's because the slayer (Buffy) lives. She exists in a way that contravenes the existing order of things. Willow's magic created the corruption. It is not the corruption itself. Buffy's existence in the slayer line at that point corrupts the restrictions put on the line by the Shadowmen. When Xander brought Buffy back it superseded magical restrictions with natural law.
 
Yes... and to prove that you tried to connect that Willow had the power to completely disrupt the slayer line in Chosen, could she have it in Bargaining. Its not a valid point because all that matters is that Buffy was resurrected, that she lives. Anybody could have performed the spell.


nerd4hire said:
I prefer to base my "script" assumptions on the scripts.
Click to expand...

Yeah, because the insinuation would be that I make my assumptions based on what I had for breakfast? The colour of my tie?

I personally prefer not to assume at all.
 
So you're not assuming the "only through Faith" rule is the only possible alternative in Season 7?

I'm curious then. What exactly are we debating?
 
Actually before I first posted in this thread I believed there were two lines, one through Faith, one through Buffy. I think I was just looking for someone to disagree with with my first post.:silly:
 
nerd4hire
nerd4hire
LOL You crack me up. So desperate for an arguement you'll argue with someone who agrees with you. I've done that.
Ok, one, Buffy hasnt been the true slayer since season 2. Faith before the whole scythe/essence thing was the activated chosen one, so when Buffy died in season 5 there wouldnt be another slayer activated because she wasnt the "true" chosen one, in order for another slayer to have been called, Faith would have to have died.
 
Yes. Everyone agrees the slayer-line passes through Faith at least to the beginning of Season 6. The possibillity for an alternative only begins after the Bargaining.

It's been said over and over again on this thread the line still passes through Faith at the time of the Gift. Joss Whedon said so (well not on this thread of course, but he did say so 🙂). It's after that the problem begins.
 
I'vw herd the arguement against the line running through buffy on season six, and that cuz she flatlined at the end of season 6 there should be another slayer. But those machines arn't exact, it's possible for the pulse to be so faint that it can't be picked up by the machine, so it's possible she didn't actually die when the machine flatlined!
 
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