Who do you think was the worst friend in Season 6?

[Priceless]

Willow was the worst friend because she bulldozed her other friends into bringing Buffy back.

Her ego got in the way of her intentions - the spell became more about 'see how clever I am and what I can do' rather than 'I am desolate at my friends death and I want her back'. She wanted congratulations for a spell well done, rather than concentrating on Buffy and what she needed.

I think this was probably a foreshadowing of what Willow was going to become this season.

 

[bespangeled]

One element I think- the deer killing. Dark blood magic but one ingredient doesn't change the intent of the spell

It's about taking them into her - regardless of intent. If you think you are getting juice and you swallow bleach it's gonna have an impact even if your intent was not to cause permanent burns. It opened Willow to magics that were too hard to channel and they stayed with her. To me, this is what really fueled her spiral - an infection of sorts.

I got the impression from that conversation that they'd had the argument many times before and Xander- and the lay person when it comes to magic- is afraid to cross the finish line because it means commitment to something permenant- that's sort of his weak point this whole season.

Willow is honest about wanting Buffy back- and she thinks its the right thing to do, to rescue her friend. Tara thinks its wrong but wants to do it anyway- which is worse imv.

XANDER: It's just ... (fidgets nervously) It feels wrong.
TARA: It is wrong. (Willow looks surprised) It's against all the laws of nature, and practically impossible to do, but it's what we agreed to. If-if you guys are changing your minds-
WILLOW: Nobody's changing their minds. Period.

Willow is definitely bullying here - and she has gotten very powerful. We saw that in the opening scene. Everyone does speak up against it, but they are too tentative and Willow isn't listening.

I think Willow's memory alteration is a far worse crime than bringing Buffy back, Because the intent there ws sentirely selfish, not simply have aspects of selfishness.

I can see a case being made for that - but it really shows how far Willow slides. She's always been interested in dark magic, and always tried to help. Well, she got a buttload of dark magic and that started to push her over. She didn't even realize the line she crossed from helping others to helping herself by changing others. I see this as a culmination of a lot of decisions Willow made through the series, and I actually blame Giles for a lot of this.

Giles was raising demons for entertainment when he was this age - he knew the dangers. If he was going to use Willow as part of the Slayer-group then he really needed to train her instead of occasionally admonishing her. Willow kept dodging a bullet, and this was the season when she was hit. Joss said that the use of blood magic at the beginning of the season was why Tara died - you have to have an even exchange - a life for a life.

This is what makes the characters interesting to me - watching them stay themselves as they grow up. The kid who once asked Amy if they could pretend the magic they were using was dark is now the adult who is "doing magic" with Amy at Rack's.

Also I forgot Spike- if he counts as Buffy's friend- since he did terrible things to her this season. I'd say he was the winner.

I never saw him as a friend, though I suppose he was the only friend Buffy had in the beginning - the only person she felt she could talk to. Yeah, that was a toxic hot mess, but I still think Willow did worse. I'm not giving either of them points for intent. Some interesting parallels there, though - except Spike didn't have a soul.

Spike said that there were always consequences for doing magic. I don't think he meant it in a mystical way. Everything in the season goes back to Willow and the spell, and her infection of darkness.

GILES: (over his shoulder) You're a very stupid girl.

Willow pauses chewing, slowly stops smiling and frowns.

WILLOW: What? Giles...
GILES: (turns to face her) Do you have any idea what you've done? The forces you've harnessed, the lines you've crossed?
WILLOW: I thought you'd be ... impressed, or, or something.
GILES: Oh, don't worry, you've ... made a very deep impression. Of everyone here ... you were the one I trusted most to respect the forces of nature.
WILLOW: Are you saying you don't trust me?
GILES: (intensely) Think what you've done to Buffy.
WILLOW: I brought her back!
GILES: At incredible risk!
WILLOW: Risk? Of what? Making her deader?
GILES: Of killing us all. Unleashing hell on Earth, I mean, shall I go on?
WILLOW: No! (stands) Giles, I did what I had to do. I did what nobody else could do.
GILES: Oh, there are others in this world who can do what you did. You just don't want to meet them. (turns away again)
WILLOW: No, probably not, but ... well, they're the bad guys. I'm not a bad guy. (upset) I brought Buffy back into this world, a-and maybe the word you should be looking for is "congratulations."
GILES: Having Buffy back in the world makes me feel ... indescribably wonderful, but I wouldn't congratulate you if you jumped off a cliff and happened to survive.
WILLOW: That's not what I did, Giles.
GILES: (angry) You were lucky.
WILLOW: I wasn't lucky. I was amazing. And how would you know? You weren't even there.
GILES: If I had been, I'd have bloody well stopped you. The magicks you channeled are more ferocious and primal than anything you can hope to understand, (even more angry) and you are lucky to be alive, you rank, arrogant amateur!

Giles angrily grabs his towel and turns to leave.

WILLOW: You're right.

He pauses by the door, looks back at her.

WILLOW: The magicks I used are very powerful. I'm very powerful. And maybe it's not such a good idea for you to piss me off.

Giles stares at her, then looks away. After a moment, Willow relents.

That's what I see - it's what they all go through this season.

 

[Monkey Pants]

Click to expand...
Willow is honest about wanting Buffy back- and she thinks its the right thing to do, to rescue her friend. Tara thinks its wrong but wants to do it anyway- which is worse imv.
Totally agree. That's another thing that makes me p.o.ed! Everyone acting like Willow sucks and Tara is amazing, when I think it can be the opposite. Here I think Tara was more in the wrong--not only did she do what she thought was wrong, whereas Willow was truly trying to do what she thought was right, but she also tried to manipulate Willow into feeling bad. Everyone acts like Willow tricked everyone into doing the spell, when hello they are adults, but Tara was the one who said "It's against all laws of man and nature, but it's what we agreed to do. And if you guys are backing out..." (or something). Like what kind of logic is that? And then she's looked at for being super supportive of Spuffy (to Buffy's face) but in s5 Intervention Willow is the supportive one when Tara calls Willow "crazy" and Buffy "nuts" but no one ever mentions this...I have a lot of indignation.

I think this is slightly negated by the fact that Willow saved Buffy's life single-handedly at least twice this season. 'Gone' and 'Doublemeat Palace' as she's fighting her own addiction.

Yeah Willow did some really great stuff this season. I still think endangering Dawn was the worst thing one of the friends did to each other.
Totally agree about all of your points about the spell though.
That's always made me angry. And then, everyone angry at her when she gets addicted to magic, but no one considers or seems sorry that the large amount of guilt they all heaped on her is (imo) partially responsible.

 

[GwenRaiden]

Willow was the most selfish. Stereotypically addiction does make a person selfish and self-serving. But the season began with her power-tripping and pushing her friends into a bad decision. The disconnect and isolation in s6 stemmed mostly from Willow's selfish actions.

 

[Iwearthecheese]

Willow is definitely bullying here

I honestly don't see any bullying from Willow. They all put her in charge- democratically voting her in- and she's acting on that.
Willow is being who she was shown to be in S2 and S5- the leader when Buffy is not there.

I can see a case being made for that - but it really shows how far Willow slides. She's always been interested in dark magic, and always tried to help. Well, she got a buttload of dark magic and that started to push her over. She didn't even realize the line she crossed from helping others to helping herself by changing others. I see this as a culmination of a lot of decisions Willow made through the series, and I actually blame Giles for a lot of this.

I agree. The magic wasn't the problem, Willow's personality flaws were the problem. The dark maigc just opened that door in her a litle wider...
It's why I love her- she's a screwup but the show is never afraid to show us that she's a screw-up, and then have her overcome her faults. She isn't glorified like some characters are.

As for Giles- his responsibility goes only so far but he does drop the ball as responsible adult for anybody who isn't named Buffy. First with Faith- he let her down as her Watcher so badly, and then he didn't intervene with Willow soon enough.

Still, Willow is a grown-up as of S4- and that's when she really kicks into gear in regards to magic.

I never saw him as a friend, though I suppose he was the only friend Buffy had in the beginning - the only person she felt she could talk to.

I'd say that would qualify as friendship. Buffy confided in him when she wouldn't confide in anybody else- not even Giles who wasn't apart of pulling her out of heaven. She told Spike because there was a connection between them.
And I do think he made Buffy's life worse than Willow because...well, I think intent comes into it. What did that person intend when they did what they did.

GILES: (over his shoulder) You're a very stupid girl.

Willow pauses chewing, slowly stops smiling and frowns.

WILLOW: What? Giles...
GILES: (turns to face her) Do you have any idea what you've done? The forces you've harnessed, the lines you've crossed?
WILLOW: I thought you'd be ... impressed, or, or something.
GILES: Oh, don't worry, you've ... made a very deep impression. Of everyone here ... you were the one I trusted most to respect the forces of nature.
WILLOW: Are you saying you don't trust me?
GILES: (intensely) Think what you've done to Buffy.
WILLOW: I brought her back!
GILES: At incredible risk!
WILLOW: Risk? Of what? Making her deader?
GILES: Of killing us all. Unleashing hell on Earth, I mean, shall I go on?
WILLOW: No! (stands) Giles, I did what I had to do. I did what nobody else could do.
GILES: Oh, there are others in this world who can do what you did. You just don't want to meet them. (turns away again)
WILLOW: No, probably not, but ... well, they're the bad guys. I'm not a bad guy. (upset) I brought Buffy back into this world, a-and maybe the word you should be looking for is "congratulations."
GILES: Having Buffy back in the world makes me feel ... indescribably wonderful, but I wouldn't congratulate you if you jumped off a cliff and happened to survive.
WILLOW: That's not what I did, Giles.
GILES: (angry) You were lucky.
WILLOW: I wasn't lucky. I was amazing. And how would you know? You weren't even there.
GILES: If I had been, I'd have bloody well stopped you. The magicks you channeled are more ferocious and primal than anything you can hope to understand, (even more angry) and you are lucky to be alive, you rank, arrogant amateur!

Giles angrily grabs his towel and turns to leave.

WILLOW: You're right.

He pauses by the door, looks back at her.

WILLOW: The magicks I used are very powerful. I'm very powerful. And maybe it's not such a good idea for you to piss me off.

Giles stares at her, then looks away. After a moment, Willow relents.

Everyone acts like Willow tricked everyone into doing the spell, when hello they are adults, but Tara was the one who said "It's against all laws of man and nature, but it's what we agreed to do.

Agree x 1000! 🙂

Yeah Willow did some really great stuff this season. I still think endangering Dawn was the worst thing one of the friends did to each other.

I love that whole scene! 😀
I especially love Giles in that whole scene- he gets really angry at Willow, but people forget that Spike got angry at Xander just the same- he was responsible for it as well.

 

[Taake]

I think they were all the worst friend.

Buffy - "protecting" her friends from the truth. She's just delaying pain, making it worse, and partly at least doing it for selfish reasons because she doesn't want to deal with their emotions (I don't really blame here for that) and uses it as an excuse to run, hide and make stupid decisions. Still being a child hoping things go away on their own.

Willow - reckless, self-centered, addict. Everything she does brings pain to everyone, including herself, and she keeps being a self-indulgent child largely.

Xander - head-in-the-sand trying to "make it all better" by ignoring the problems/casting spells to make them go away. Overwhelmed, quite certainly, but still being a child about it.

Dawn - an actual child, not her responsibility to be a friend at all.

Giles - leaving, lame dude. Tough love to a deeply depressed young woman whose job it is to save the world, uncool. (It makes sense for ASH to leave, not for Giles though unfortunately. To me)

 

[sosa lola]

I've always thought they could have come up with a better excuse for ASH leaving.

 

[bespangeled]

And I do think he made Buffy's life worse than Willow because...well, I think intent comes into it. What did that person intend when they did what they did.

I think his intent was the same as Willow's - to help Buffy.

 

[Monkey Pants]

I love that whole scene! 😀
I especially love Giles in that whole scene- he gets really angry at Willow, but people forget that Spike got angry at Xander just the same- he was responsible for it as well.

Which scene are you talking about?🙂

 

[Samuel Reyes]

Jonathan. He betrayed Warren and Andrew.😀

Likewise I say it's Warren and Andrew, they set Jonathan up to take the fall.

Of the Scoobies... I kinda want to say Buffy but she was brought back against her will, so you can't really blame her, and I realize that if I were to say Buffy it would only be because it annoyed me how she spent all season trying to get out of depression.
Willow definitely fell victim to her own ego in bringing Buffy back, but there was a stretch of episodes in the middle of the season ('Gone' comes to mind) where she genuinely tried to be a good friend and help Buffy without using magic.
TBH everybody was a little bad for not trying to console Anya after Xander left her at the altar...
I guess it's Giles. I understand wanting to leave to let Buffy sort out her problems, but after she came back from the dead and is clearly emotionally unstable? Not the best timing in the world for a life lesson.

 

[Iwearthecheese]

Which scene are you talking about?

Ick, I messed up my posting. 😳

I was refering to the Giles/Willow scene that @bespangeled posted, its a great, dark moment in the episode.

The Willow/Dawn stuff- I agree that Willow was terrible and almost got Dawn killed. I like that she reforms after this and tries to change her toxic behaviour.

I think his intent was the same as Willow's - to help Buffy.

I think Spike thinks he's helping Buffy- to begin with, but he also recognises that he's hurting her eventually and yet cares more about what he's getting out of it.
He's the guy who recognises emotional pain better than most.
I know 'souless demon' and 'selfish' are intertwined but he did knowingly hurt Buffy quite a few times.

 

[Monkey Pants]

I was refering to the Giles/Willow scene that @bespangeled posted, its a great, dark moment in the episode.

I love that scene. It is superbly acted. The way Alyson Hannigan's facial expressions transition from happy and proud to shocked and hurt to angry to surprised at her own behavior is nuanced and incredible!

I like that she reforms after this and tries to change her toxic behaviour.

Yup. I really love her season 6 arc. It's pretty epic plus she's just such a great actress. And she's looking really hot 🙂rolleyes🙂.

 

[bespangeled]

I think Spike thinks he's helping Buffy- to begin with, but he also recognises that he's hurting her eventually and yet cares more about what he's getting out of it.
He's the guy who recognises emotional pain better than most.
I know 'souless demon' and 'selfish' are intertwined but he did knowingly hurt Buffy quite a few times.

I think he is trying to take care of her the way he would take care of an insane vampire - the only successful relationship he ever had. While he knows he's hurting her, I don't think he has a grasp on what, or how, or why. But yeah - he definitely goes way, way beyond healthy - both in what he does to her and what he encourages her to do to him. After the break-up Spike was still Spike, and what he did was unforgivable.

But we also have Willow filling herself with dark magic by choice - what she said to Buffy (which I also think is true) and what she tried to do to Dawn. Willow had her own demons, and her own choices, but after Tara died she was still Willow, and she tried to kill every single member of the scoobs - she knew who they were, and that was why she wanted them dead. That kinda gives her the bad friend award.

 

[Iwearthecheese]

Well yeah, if you include Dark Willow in the 'bad friend' award considerations then Willow takes the cake...steals the cake and skins it alive probably. 😱

 

[cryptwarmer]

Interestingly the first time I watched S6 I was Buffy, Willow, and Dawn combined. I was insane, abusing substances, and totally immersed in out of control behavior. No one knew what to do with me, so they did nothing and watched me implode.

Were they bad friends? Clueless? In Denial? Terrified? Was there anything they could have done, should have done? Was I the bad friend for doing what I did? Even in hindsight I don't know what they could have done that would have helped me.

I honestly don't know how to answer any of those questions in my life and I have the same problem with the characters. What do you do when you see that behavior but have no clue and no experience how to address it in your friend?

It's like everyone was messed up, caught up in their own problems and trying to keep their own head above the water.

It makes me think of the song "What Can't We Do When We're Together?" was that ironic? or was it pointing to the fact that they lost the "together" and it was all going to heck in a hand basket as a result?

 

[Fuffy Baith]

And then she's looked at for being super supportive of Spuffy (to Buffy's face) but in s5 Intervention Willow is the supportive one when Tara calls Willow "crazy" and Buffy "nuts" but no one ever mentions this...I have a lot of indignation

Yea, I feel like a Tara saying that in Intervention was a bit out of character and only done for a comedic moment. I think that after seeing Spike's love for Buffy and protecting Dawn she just kind of forgot he was an evil demon (which everyone else does too). She shouldn't have encouraged it, but it makes sense she would have understood it. Also, she thinks it's just sex and that Buffy shouldn't be punishing herself for just having sex. We don't know if Tara told her something else off camera, cause she does seem to be trying to keep Spike away from Buffy in Older and Far Away. Which are the only good moments in that episode.

I've always thought they could have come up with a better excuse for ASH leaving.

yes they could have. Wasn't Giles technically Buffy's watcher again, since the council didn't know she died. They could have had him called away for a while on something. If the writers had known the First was going to be the s7 big bad then that could have been foreshadowed a bit. Mention the potentials being killed around the world or something. Might have helped need less setup for s7,which might have made that season better. And we could have spent some time with Buffy, Willow and Xander being good friends to each other.

 

[Iwearthecheese]

She shouldn't have encouraged it, but it makes sense she would have understood it. Also, she thinks it's just sex and that Buffy shouldn't be punishing herself for just having sex. We don't know if Tara told her something else off camera, cause she does seem to be trying to keep Spike away from Buffy in Older and Far Away.

I think Tara's reaction came from Buffy's, she saw that Buffy was ashamed and so didn't judge her. Tara realised that she needed comfort and support. I could see that if Buffy had had a different mindset Tara would've been more forthright with her concerns- maybe more towards Willow's initial reaction (very mixed).

Tara was intuitive enough to realise what Buffy needed, which was unconditional support for somebody who already hated themselves at that point in time. Why be harsh on them? That doesn't serve any purpose.

 

[sosa lola]

Yea, I feel like a Tara saying that in Intervention was a bit out of character and only done for a comedic moment.

I don't think it's out of character. Nobody liked Spike in S5. Tara was as hostile to him in I Was Made to Love You as everybody else. Clearly after Spike started helping the gang, Tara started to warm up to him a bit.

 

[Dora]

Giles for leaving if he had stayed I do not think any of the problems would have happened and Spike for taking advantage of a mentally ill Buffy.In reality it was JW and MN for destroying the core four in their attempt to push Spikes story
 
Ok maybe damaged in season six Destroyed in season seven can you really believe they chucked out Buffy from her home for Faith just to push the Spike story even more!

 

[Klaus Kartoffel]

My ranking, starting with the worst:

1. Giles - To me, it was plain cowardliness and an avoiding strategy. In the sense of "What I can't see, doesn't happen or concern me." I don't think it was intended by the writers but that's how it came across to me. Buffy was clearly not okay and Willow had given off enough warning signals already. And then to act surprised later...
Season 06 & 07 really screwed with his character, to my annoyance since I basically like him. The worst is that his arc didn't get a conclusion. It just wasn't an issue...

2. Spike - Well, to manipulate Buffy and trying to pull her to the dark side, followed with an attempted rape speaks for itself.

3. Willow - Her magic rampage speaks for itself either. Extenuating circumstances: Negative influence of dark magic, addiction, and grief. AND she's cute, hot and my favorite BtVS character.😀

4. Xander, Anya & Tara - Noticed Buffy's and Willow's issues but didn't do anything helpful. Xander told Buffy about Willow's problems and expected that Buffy would take the lead. Thumbs up to Xander for the "Yellow Crayon" speech, though.

5. Buffy & Dawn - Dawn is a kid. Kid's are annoying and do stupid stuff. It's a rule. Buffy does what she always does throughout the series. She doesn't confide to her friends when she really should.