Willow killing Warren

Chosen Enemy

Chosen Enemy

Losing my soul
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I know she was in pain and horribly pissed off, but killing a human could be crossing the line. I didn't like Warren, and I do think he should have died. But even Buffy knows that it's wrong to kill a human, even though he was bad, even though he killed Tara and almost killed Buffy. But as Buffy said, there's prison for people like that. I do think Buffy wanted Warren dead, but she's against killing humans. Always have been.

Ignore your love for Willow and your hate for Warren for a second. Do you think it was okay killing him, a human? Did Willow cross a line? Could Warren have been punished in some other ways?
 
I think in the real world it's the most terrible thing you could possibly do. And I definitely do think it's wrong.
Even if the person that you kill or want to kill has already killed someone.
But it's just wrong. Because that makes you exactly as bad as the other person.


But I have to say that in a TV show it's OK. Or more than OK.
But only because of the story line. TV shows would be sooo boring without killing people 😛

But yes, it was very wrong.
 
S
sisterofmercy
[No message]
Objectively, I believe in the judicial system however flawed it may be. He shot Tara, he should be arrested, given a trial, and sentenced by a jury of his peers. He was human and committed a human crime. He should have been given human justice. People are regularly punished for shooting and killing someone's loved one by the legal system.

Now, subjectively, if someone killed my husband, I am absolutely sure that in the moment I would be enraged and would very much want to react as Willow did. That doesn't make it right though.
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VisionGirl
VisionGirl
ITA with this whole post!
I believe it's obvious Willow crossed a line. Not only does every other character acknowledge that, she does in all of season 7. It was a moment of weakness and a crime of pure passion and grief. I agree, Warren was a bad man and because it's a TV show and not at all real, I wanted him to die. In real life, if Warren was a real guy who raped a girl, killed her... and then shot another, I'd want him to rot in jail.
 
Willow killing Warren was wrong and she faces this in season seven. But personally, I'm glad she killed him.

I don't think its right to take a life as punishment for taking a life. But if the person is evil I'm not going to cry over there death. Just like I think the death penalty is wrong and should be done away with, doesnt mean I'm going to mourn all the murderers and child molesters who are killed because of it.
 
I, in most cases, believe in an eye for an eye. I'm all for the death penalty and such, but I think they get it very easy. They want to make sure they don't suffer when they die. Lethal injection is just going to sleep. It doesn't hurt. It's too easy. And look how many people wait decades to be put to death. Why? So they can appeal for the 59th time? So many people die on death row before they're executed. [/rant]

I think he got what he deserved, fully. He took a human life. There's no excuse for that. There's no reason for that. Who are you to decide that someone shouldn't live? And if you make that decision, why shouldn't your fate be decided for you, and you be put to death as well?

Yes, he killed Tara on accident, but he meant to take another life, Buffy. He had a weapon intended to use to kill someone. He had made that decision. When he made that decision to kill another human being, he sealed his fate. He deserved to die. The fact that Willow did it just made it better, IMO. Justice at it's finest.

For once, I agreed with Dawn. I will never say that again. 😛
 
Of course Willow was wrong. I don't blame Willow because she was not in her right frame of mind, but still. Nothing you can do in this world deserves for you to be killed, nothing. Warren was a complete fool, yes, but Willow shouldn't be executioner because no one is allowed to decide who lives and dies. Warren should have been put in jail for life. But death? No one deserves that.
 
Willow crossed a line yes that is true do I think it was wrong what she did nope not at all.
 
Warren deserved to die. I'm glad Willow killed him. As Brennan says in Bones 'some people are evil, they don't deserve to be in this world.'

The only thing that I'm not glad about is that Willow felt guilt over it, which I personally believe is unjustified. She should not have been made to feel like the bad guy over her actions. Yes, the bad magic thing, I'm going to end the world thing was terrible, but the way everyone made her feel guilty over it? Not that cool.
 
I can't justify what Willow did to Warren. It's easy to say eye-for-an-eye, but what she did was vigilante justice for a human crime. To say she was right is to say that the relatives of any murder victim should be allowed to hunt down the murderer, torture them horrifically, and kill them. There's no way I could agree with that.
 
Lindsey McDonald said:
relatives of any murder victim should be allowed to hunt down the murderer, torture them horrifically, and kill them. There's no way I could agree with that.
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I could! I think the biggest problem with the death penalty is that people can never be sure of whether someone has committed the crime or not. I think that if my dad caught my mother (or visa versa) getting murdered then I would be 100% for my dad killing the bastard. People that kill don't deserve to be here, it's really that simple. Killing for justice is different to killing for pleasure.
 
caitaintdead said:
I could! I think the biggest problem with the death penalty is that people can never be sure of whether someone has committed the crime or not. I think that if my dad caught my mother (or visa versa) getting murdered then I would be 100% for my dad killing the bastard. People that kill don't deserve to be here, it's really that simple. Killing for justice is different to killing for pleasure.
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But surely allowing relatives to hunt down and kill whoever did it is far less likely to punish the person who did it than the Death Penalty, after a fair trial! IIRC, Willow never even saw Warren do it, she was simply told he did. In the real world, it's often even less certain, because there's often no witness. And I don't think trusting people in Willow's condition to dispense justice responsibly is a good idea at all! I understand the sentiment - regardless of views on the death penalty - but it cannot work in practice.

Plus, look what it did to her. True, she was going down that path already, but killing someone that violently is bound to change something in you psychologically. Moreover, when she came to her senses, she had to deal with what she'd done. She had to deal with the memory of the joy she felt as she ripped the skin from his body. Any normal person who found themself in a similar situation in the real world would have to live with that for the rest of their life. I wouldn't underestimate just what that could do to a person.
 
I think it was very wrong to kill Warren, yes. In my opinion noone is born bad, it's all a matter of circumstances and which kind of behavoir that is incouraged or discouraged around you. I'm not saying Warren shouldn't have been held responsible for what he did. He should've. But I don't think killing someone or even punishing them are the way to go. Treatment and support have been proven to be way more affective. That's the kind of society that I want to live in - one that believes in the good in people and tries to forgive even the most horrid things, not one were no mercy is shown. Also, a person could do the most horrible things but that doesn't mean that that person IS horrible or that he or she are going to stay the way they are at the moment forever. I very firmly believe that everyone can change, it's all a matter of finding the right context in which change could take place.

On another note: This thread title is a total spoiler for someone who isn't done watching. Name change please? 🙂
 
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Willow took away Warren's life without a trial in an inhumane manner. Yes, we know that Warren was the one who pulled the trigger because we saw it. Willow didn't. Which may be the case in many murders in real life. I don't think it is a good path to travel down to begin allowing the wronged family or friends of a murdered person to kill the person that the think did it. That's why we have a legal system.
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T
This Year's Girl
[No message]
L
Lindsey McDonald
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Taake
Taake
[No message]
I'm with Linds. I can't and will never be every to justify Willow's actions, in real life or TV.

There's been a few mentions of people saying if it happened to their partner they'd do the same but I just don't think I could. Its make me feel sick to even think about causing another human being pain let alone actually taking their life. I don't think murder is a rational or justified act of grief.

And its the same for Willow. Yes, what Warren did was wrong, absolutely. But he was a human and Willow had absolutely no place to do what she did. Just like grief is not a good enough excuse for murder neither is revenge.

I could get into the whole death penalty/legal system and the hypocrisy of it (because it links to Willow's hypocrisy too) but I'm not going to. Basically, to kill someone because you're so grief stricken that they killed your loved one, to cause that same pain is just nonsensical. But this quote, from Gandalf LotR, sprang to my mind immediately with this topic:

Many that live deserve death. Some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them, Frodo? Do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. Even the very wise cannot see all ends.
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T
This Year's Girl
[No message]
Good quote, Flannen. A murder is a wrong that can never be made right. It wouldn't have mattered if Willow killed Warren a million times, Tara would still not un-die. I can't remember if I cheered a little the first time I watched this or not, I probably did, but I still don't think it's right.
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This made me think of something: My aunt has every single Buffy figurine released. One of of Tara is signed by Amber Benson herself and it says, "Warren got what he deserved!"

More seriously, I mean, like Xander said, I can't imagine the pain that Willow was in. But as everyone else has said here, that in no way justifies her actions. Warren was horrible, but he had a soul. He was a person. He didn't even kill Tara using magic or anything supernatural. It was a person killing another person with a gun. Killing Warren wasn't Willow's call to make.
 
As pathetic as Warren was, I don't think it was right for Willow to kill him. I can understand her anger and hatred towards him, and that is completely justified but I think turning Warren over to the police would have been the right thing to do in this situation.

He wasn't worth the guilt and pain that was caused by killing him.
 
I hated him. I don't see anything wrong with Willow killing him and think the rest of the gang should get rid of their no killing humans rule. Some humans are just as bad as demons soul or not.
 
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