Xander = awful

[slayed]

Has anyone else noticed just how awful xander is as a character?

Ok so... first off he has irrational hatred of Angel because he's jealous of Buffy. Get over yourself xand! She doesn't HAVE to like you! In fact, there's no reason she should...

And then in Becoming part 2 he doesn't tell Buffy that Willow is going to try the spell again... thereby setting into motion the chain of events that led to Buffy having to kill her boyfriend.

Then at the end of that episode when they're all discussing what might have happened, he suggests that maybe Buffy stopped Angel in time, or something... basically he lies to himself, because he knows exactly what might have happened through his awful actions.

Then he is absolutely HORRIBLE to Buffy in Dead Man's Party, just because she had been dealing ... dealing with the stuff that HE himself caused.

So all due to his stupid irrational hatred of Angel, Buffy's romance gets destroyed and her world is ripped apart.

He is NO friend of Buffy's, and she should know that. I'm glad he lost that eye.

 

[BuffyElevated]

WOW, harsh much?? I disagree with you on an extreme level, especially about his eye. Come on...
As much as people say it, I absolutely do not believe that Xander's hatred towards Angel is all about his feelings for Buffy. In S1, Xander's best friend was killed by a vampire. I think from that point on it colored his opinion of all vampires.
Xander's decision to lie about Willow's "message" to Buffy was crappy, I will give you that. However, maybe he thought that if Buffy knew what was going on it would be a distraction that could cost them all their lives. If she knew Willow was trying to do the spell, she would have went easier on him, and if the spell hadn't worked, then it would have all been for nothing and it could have been an epic mistake, sending the entire world to Hell. I always thought that Xander knew this and that was why he didn't want Buffy to know, just in case it didn't work.
In Dead Man's Party, I understand that Buffy left because she was going through something huge and didn't know how to deal. She had been through so much, I think she shut down and her mind told her to just run away from it all. Look at it from her mom's and friends' perspective though... They spend all this time worrying and having to take over for her 'cause no one else is going to, and then she pops back up and expects all of them to just forget about it and go on as if it never happened? I definitely understood where Joyce and Xander were coming from.

 

[Emzzie]

hmm. While I agree with some of your points such as it was wrong of him to screw with Buffy, I believe this post is bit harsh. Xander was very imature at times, but you mention nothing but the earlier seasons. With the whole Angel thing, that was one stupid imature mistake of his that set off alot of things. As for other things he did, like hating on Spike for example, we needed at least one character to be the one to say it was wrong, because in many ways it was. So I think that Xander's character in the early seasons was rather imature, but after that I think he was very dedicated in the later seasons, becoming one that was there for Buffy, fought his heart out and contributed to the group.

As for losing the eye....frankly, I find it disgusting to say that.

 

[AndrewCrossett]

Xander was a great guy and a good friend, who was capable of being a real a-hole at times. Just like most of us, and just like all the other characters in the show. (Except Oz).

 

[slayed]

Ok guys.. please understand that I wrote that having just rewatched season 2, and now i'm just about to rewatch season 3. I know that Xander has his good points, and that obviously he's not as bad as I said... but the things he said to Buffy.. particularly in Dead Man's Party.. just make me so MAD, that I was just venting.

And obviously I didn't mean the eye thing, it was just a joke...

 

[Lyri]

Xander was human. That was his purpose on the show, to be the guy who made mistakes, who screwed up, who loved his friends beyond any and all reason. We needed a character who, while fighting vampires, saving the world, sleeping with Slayers and marrying ex-demons, was just like us, fallible, scared, sometimes jealous. We needed that humanity amongst all the super-people.

I've never made a secret of the fact that the reason I started watching BtVS was purely because of Xander, it was his character that dragged me in, and I watched the show for the first season and a half just to see him every week. I still love him to this day, and he remains my favorite BtVS character.

He is Buffy's best friend, the one person, out of everyone, including her sister, who she knows will always be right there at her side. And he lost an eye proving that to her.

 

[slayed]

Oh, I just realised I posted this in the wrong section... sorry guys.

Anyway, further to my previous reply I would just like to say sorry if I offended anyone with my original post. I do not completely hate Xander, actually. I just let myself go a bit. I certainly didn't come here with the intention of making enemies and it makes me sad that I have managed to alienate myself already.

 

[Lyri]

You haven't alienated yourself, we're just a very passionate buncha people, and a lot of us are very strong Xander supporters, as you can see, lol.

Never be afraid to raise a topic, or voice your opinion here, but you just need to be prepared for the fact that not everyone is going to agree with you. But I promise, we really are nice people! 😀

 

[Revolver]

You could make just as strong an argument against a lot of the other characters.

 

[anyatara]

I love Xander, and for the most part, I don't agree. He had a huge crush on Buffy, and he hated vampires after Jesse was sired; so he wasn't the biggest fan of Angel in the first place, never mind the fact he and Buffy got together. The reason he didn't tell Buffy about the restoration spell is because, in my opinion at least, I think he knew it wouldn't necessarily work. Willow was hurt, and had no-where the power she did in later seasons; he knew there was a huge chance she couldn't pull it off. He definitely matured over the seasons, and maybe in season two he wasn't the Xander I love in the later seasons; but I still think it's a little much to say he wasn't a friend of Buffy's. He was trying to protect her, on some level.

And as for him losing his eye? I'm not gonna say anything too much, I'll just end up ranting. But no, I don't think Xander deserved to lose an eye.

 

[saturn5]

Love the X-man, he's the everyman. Sure he's not perfect but who is?

 

[PrincessBuffy16]

Um I think you're being harsh with the last line. He is Buffy's best friend, he and Willow, and that tittle is well deserved. I am mad at Xander because he lied to Buffy in Becoming Part II, because if he told her the thruth, maybe the ending would be different, and we see that left mark on Buffy. Yeah, he was jealous, but that is the act of an ordinary guy who likes one girl and can't have her. But I don't think he's awful. I love Xander. He is funny, and I think he's Buffy's strenght. He did some wrong things, but who didn't? Was Willow always right? Or Buffy? Or Giles? But I think all of them had more light sides, then dark ones.

 

[sosa lola]

Has anyone else noticed just how awful xander is as a character?

I haven't. I find him a very interesting character with so many qualities being bad and good. He's not a pure saint or a pure evil character, he's a mix of both, just like all of us.

Ok so... first off he has irrational hatred of Angel because he's jealous of Buffy. Get over yourself xand! She doesn't HAVE to like you! In fact, there's no reason she should...

I don't think Xander hated Angel until he lost his soul. Before that he disliked him because Buffy picked him over himself -and let's not forget the fact that Angel is a vampire to begin with. But he never wished Angel's death "“after they got to know him that is. Kendra had stated that Angel should be killed, and Xander defended Angel.

After Angel lost his soul and started missing with them, things got more complicated and Xander's reasons for hating him are more than mere jealousy.

And then in Becoming part 2 he doesn't tell Buffy that Willow is going to try the spell again... thereby setting into motion the chain of events that led to Buffy having to kill her boyfriend.

I think she'd have killed him whether Xander told her or not, but it was a lousy move on Xander's part.

Then at the end of that episode when they're all discussing what might have happened, he suggests that maybe Buffy stopped Angel in time, or something... basically he lies to himself, because he knows exactly what might have happened through his awful actions.

I actually loved that moment, he looked a little guilty there.

Then he is absolutely HORRIBLE to Buffy in Dead Man's Party, just because she had been dealing ... dealing with the stuff that HE himself caused.

He caused nothing. Angel turned evil because of sex, Kendra was killed because Buffy fell in Angel's trap, and she was kicked out of school because of Kendra's murder, Joyce couldn't handle the truth about Buffy being a Slayer because it's huge, Buffy had to kill Angel because he'd pulled out the sword; all those problems made her want to escape -as well as Xander and (Willow in Buffy's POV) cheering her on to kill Angel.

So all due to his stupid irrational hatred of Angel, Buffy's romance gets destroyed and her world is ripped apart.

Actually, sex destroyed it, as well as Angel being a vampire, therefore no normal future... etc. Xander's part is so small in the doom that is Buffy's relationship with Angel.

He is NO friend of Buffy's, and she should know that.

I opened a thread on that a while ago. Personally, I think the good Xander had done for Buffy outweighs the bad.

 

[Misty]

I don't hate Xander, but he does have bad moments. Like, I'm mad at him for wanting to kill Angel in Becoming Part 1, for having sex with Faith which btw wasn't smart seeing as it was a one night stand, cheating on Cordelia, and leaving Anya at the alter.

 

[BuffyElevated]

Oh, I just realised I posted this in the wrong section... sorry guys.

Anyway, further to my previous reply I would just like to say sorry if I offended anyone with my original post. I do not completely hate Xander, actually. I just let myself go a bit. I certainly didn't come here with the intention of making enemies and it makes me sad that I have managed to alienate myself already.

Like Lyri said you haven't alienated yourself! There's just a lot of us here who love Xander an feel very strongly as a character. You stated your opinions and we're stating ours... It doesn't mean you've made any enemies. 😉

 

[Joan the Vampire Slayer]

Has anyone else noticed just how awful xander is as a character?

First, I'd like to preface this by saying that I am in s way attacking you. Xander is one of my least favorite characters, but this post was too good to pass up 😉

Ok so... first off he has irrational hatred of Angel because he's jealous of Buffy. Get over yourself xand! She doesn't HAVE to like you! In fact, there's no reason she should...

First off, Xander's hatred of Angel is not solely as a result of his jealousy. Xander hates vampires. Always have, always will. Jesse was killed by one. Xander hates Angel because he killed Jenny, not because he was involved with Buffy.

And then in Becoming part 2 he doesn't tell Buffy that Willow is going to try the spell again... thereby setting into motion the chain of events that led to Buffy having to kill her boyfriend.

I agree that this was indeed Xander's worst moment. Yet, IMO, Xander has redeemed himself since his decision to withhold that informaiton from Buffy. He was young, and immature, and stupid. Give the guy a break. I know it's hard to get past.

We don't know that - even if Xander did tell her about Willow's attempt to re-insoul Angel - that Buffy could have stopped the portal from opening, anyway. When she got there, Angelus had already used his blood to open it, thanks to Drusilla's thrall on Giles, and thus causing him to admit to "Jenny" that it was his blood that was needed to awaken Acathla. So, saying that Xander was responsible for Buffy having to send Angel to Hell is incorrect.

Then at the end of that episode when they're all discussing what might have happened, he suggests that maybe Buffy stopped Angel in time, or something... basically he lies to himself, because he knows exactly what might have happened through his awful actions.

Again, agreed. Definitely not Xander's finest moment. Yet, all of the Scoobies have done morally questionable things based on selfish motives.

Then he is absolutely HORRIBLE to Buffy in Dead Man's Party, just because she had been dealing ... dealing with the stuff that HE himself caused.

Can you elaborate on this?

So all due to his stupid irrational hatred of Angel, Buffy's romance gets destroyed and her world is ripped apart.

Again, it's not an irrational hatred. Angel killed Jenny Calendar, one of Xander's favorite teachers and Giles' girlfriend. Xander has every right, at this point, to hate vampires.

He is NO friend of Buffy's, and she should know that. I'm glad he lost that eye.

Xander is and has always been Buffy's best friend, regardless if you like him or not. He's made mistakes, but he's learned from them and attempted to make amends. Buffy trusts him with her life, her sisters life, and she has said that he is her "strength." There's no denying the importance of him in her life.

---------- Post added at 03:17 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:13 PM ----------

Oh, I just realised I posted this in the wrong section... sorry guys.

Anyway, further to my previous reply I would just like to say sorry if I offended anyone with my original post. I do not completely hate Xander, actually. I just let myself go a bit. I certainly didn't come here with the intention of making enemies and it makes me sad that I have managed to alienate myself already.

As Lyri said, NEVER be afraid to say what you feel! That's why we're all here! We love hearing others opinions. Just because we don't agree doesn't mean that you're alienating yourself!

Hell, if voicing strong opinions is a way to alienate yourself on here...I'd have been gone a long time ago! lol

 

[BillyidolwannaB]

I personally think Xander was the shit.

 

[AndrewCrossett]

While it was obnoxious of Xander to keep Willow's re-ensouling attempt from Buffy, I don't think it would have made any difference. The Acathla gate had already been opened before Angel's soul returned, and the only way to close it was by sacrificing him. Buffy knew his soul was back and could have chosen not to sacrifice him... by sacrificing everyone.

In fact, you could argue that it would have been disastrous for Buffy to have known about Willow's attempt when she went into the fight. She would have been holding back the whole time, hoping his soul would return, and he would have taken advantage of her hesitation and killed her.

Xander did in fact cross the line in "Becoming", accusing Buffy of not caring about Jenny's death, and his self-righteous lecturing of her in "Dead Man's Party", but he was getting back as good as he was giving. In the first case Giles nearly decked him, and in the second Buffy got up in his face and was about 5 seconds away from mopping the floor with him when the zombies arrived.

 

[faeriegrrl27]

All the characters have their flaws and that's what makes us love them. Xander can be a jerk sometimes. And so can Buffy and Spike and... ok *sometimes* Willow. It's what makes them well-rounded. I agree that Xander can be immature and the like, but he develops and that's what makes him interesting. He makes mistakes. We make mistakes. Xander is relatable and I, personally, find him outrageously amusing and extremely complex.

 

[iDarthRosenberg]

I agree! watching dead man's party right now actually. i do understand his purpose on the show and all and that alot of you like him doesn't make him any less awful. It's understandable that friends fight and all but he really is a total idiotic selfish loser prick. Further illustrated by leaving anya at the altar(even with the circumstances that happened to be false he still could have talked to her first instead of running away like a big pansy. I suppose he's kinda cool in season 8 but not really necessary for it to be him. Anyone ever wonder why no one on the show likes him? and by no one i mean students, giles kind of, extras...obviously not the main cast because what kind of a story would that make for? Probably why he's targeted by all the demon women. WORST BVERSE CHARACTER EVER! or at least most annoying