Angel : Unpopular Opinions

I agree with Priceless - I don't particularly care for Wesley; never have. He was always a poor man Giles' as a watcher to begin with, and then you list off all the shitty things he did (stealing Connor was really the worst)...he wasn't all bad but he wasn't ever great fun either.

Pylea Arc is fun af, even if totally disjointed from the overall season.

Buffy Season 2 is not the best.

Angel Season 4 is the best season of that series & Jasmine is an amazing mind**** of a villain.

Kennedy & Connor are cool characters.

Riley Finn is an amazing boyfriend and great character that is under appreciated by the audience probably as much as he was by Buffy.
 
caitaintdead
caitaintdead
I disagree with you HARD on just about everything... But Kennedy is a great character and Pylea was fun.
Priceless
Priceless
Pretty much agree with everything. Wes is so over rated, I just don't get the love
I don't get Wesley's alarm about the prediction (even if it is false) that "the father will kill the son". Connor is a unique creature. There has never been a child of two vampires. This is all unknown territory for everyone. Did he ever give any consideration to the idea that Angel might have to kill Connor? A child of two vampires could be expected to be irredeemably evil and may require death at the hands of the father. He turned out to be irredeemably whiny but Wesley should have seen this prediction as a sign of a future danger caused by the son. Wesley continues his bad judgement from BtVS where he had a wetworks team try to kill Faith (who was actually Buffy in Faith's body) and now he is ready to make unilateral moves again without any thought or understanding. Never mind that he was now being presented as a badass, his pride and bad judgement were just as damaging as when he was a buffoon.
 
I hate that the title "Waiting in the Wings" was used for Cangel and then in such a literal definition, that Angel & Cordelia as a ship are "not yet active or important but are ready or likely to be soon."

It feels like another Bangel ripoff but without the storytelling symbolism.

When Angel first encountered Buffy, he chose to act as her guardian angel, there in the shadows waiting to help her if she needs him. When he told her his name is Angel, there was an angel statue in the same frame behind him.

His relationship with Buffy is one big "waiting in the wings" since they both see each other as The One and they imagine a happily ever after with each other (Buffy's daylight beach dream, Angel's daylight wedding dream, IWRY) but can't be together (perfect happiness, ancient prophecies, etc) until both of their series end. It's "when he shanshus" or "when she's cookies" and both hoping some day they'll make it through the very dark long tunnel and into the light.

Angel is Seth from City Of Angels, the man who always wears black and broods, who wanders Los Angeles and meets a blonde woman he falls so in love with he wants to give up being immortal & paranormal so they can be together.
 
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crazysoulless said:
What do you like about it?
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Well almost everything.

- Even though the episode ends on a kiss, Cordy and Angel spend most of it rekindling a friendship that hasn't had the same level of connection since season 2.
- Lindsey's comeback is one of the highlights of season 5, and his attempt to defeat Angel, though ignorant, is really entertaining.
- Spike's role in this episode, though limited, provides some awesome comic relief, including talking about how evil tastes and fighting off zombies with a classic, "We're all dead men here."
- Cordy is back to her old self, bitching all over Eve, something that someone needed to do, while also enjoying the good old days researching with Wes.
- The goal is supposed to be to get Angel back on track, and it absolutely does, just not in the way you would expect. One might say going to W&H is what got Angel off track, while this episode actually helps him to realize exactly why he needed to do that.
- In a forgotten subplot, Wes and Fred's relationship is still developing, and when he performs the spell to remove the tattoos, she looks at him with an admiration that he has always looked at her with.
- Cordy and Angel's last moments together are a perfect send off. When they first met in LA, Angel helped Cordy to realize she had another path. Now, she has to reveal to him that she does have another path, and it's beyond him. The phone call reveals that Cordy's body was the one in the hospital, proving that the Powers are still on Angel's side, willing to bend the laws of science for him. Cordy's kiss, as we learn later, gives Angel a vision of sorts. This of course is the perfect bookend to go along with the very first day that Cordy found out she had the visions, when she tried to kiss Angel to get rid of them, and a callback to Birthday, when she kissed Angel to take the visions back.
 
I don't like Fred. Her whole cutesy thing feels really forced and bothers me (her 'evitable' speech annoys me so much). I only liked her in The Magic Bullet. I don't like her with Wes.

Even though it made me cry, I didn't like A Hole in the World all that much because Fred's death feels really voyeuristic to me, especially since she's another female character dying in agony while the men play hero.

Wes is a badass in the later seasons but I'm not really a fan. I like him in S1/2.

I hate all of the Angelus appearances, especially in S4 (including Orpheus). I love Angelus in BtVS but he's way over the top in AtS. In BtVS he was creepy but dignified and excelled at subtle psychological torment. In AtS he was clownish and his "psychological torment" was just yelling obvious, crude things. And what's with the bragging to random demons at a bar?

I love Harmony so much and all Harmony-centric episodes.

I don't like Cangel (not sure how unpopular that is, though)

I Will Remember You was good but never made me emotional (then again, neither does The Gift or The Prom, so maybe I'm just made of stone).

I am utterly indifferent to Lorne.
 
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One of the reasons I dislike Fred is because the writers gave her that terrible damaging trope of a really skinny girl who can eat anything and still stay thin. It's pretty much bs (unless you have a medical condition and that is never mentioned) It is just another trope that pressurises women into conforming to both being incredibly thin but also not annoying their menfolk by worrying about what they are eating. It's a male fantasy of what a woman should be like and it annoys me and makes me dislike Fred just a little bit more than I should 😀
 
EarthLogic
EarthLogic
Actually it's not bs. I used to have a classmate like that.
Mrs Gordo
Mrs Gordo
Omg you are right I should hate her...never thought of this.
Antho
Antho
I still love her lol
My hot take (what hasn't been said yet I think): DB's acting stinks. Riley gets blamed for being cardboard, but Angel came from the same cardboard company.

I agree with those who liked the character of Nina, as far as it went. She deserved character progression and S6 time if it had happened.
 
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AnthonyCordova said:
My hot take (what hasn't been said yet I think): DB's acting stinks. Riley gets blamed for being cardboard, but Angel came from the same cardboard company.
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Over 8 seasons?! Bit harsh.
 
crazysoulless said:
I cringe every time they use the word CHAMPION or mention the Powers That Be. They sound like gullible kids and not heroes navigating their destinies. It's so easy to see how they got tricked.
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Don't like it either. Powers that Be I'm ok with. I like that they started to question the use of the 'champion'/'hero' term a bit in S5.
 
Antho
Antho
YEP
PaulParmar1 said:
Especially cause there's so many Bangel fans!
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Don't put the blame on the Bangel fans, put it on the producers. They didn't do things in a good way. Well, NO ! I'm going to be honest ! Put the blame on Joss Whedon and why he ruins Cordy character just because he had issues with Charisma !
 
Priceless
Priceless
But S3 Cangel was very sweet
MarieVampSlayer
MarieVampSlayer
Yes!!!!!! JW was a bitch to Cordy!
Also an unpopular opinion :
Antho said:
Don't put the blame on the Bangel fans, put it on the producers. They didn't do things in a good way. Well, NO ! I'm going to be honest ! Put the blame on Joss Whedon and why he ruins Cordy character just because he had issues with Charisma !
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So true. Joss Whedon is the worst & he missed the opportunity with them in Season 4!
He's a talented idiot lol!
 
Antho said:
Sorry I'm angry to Joss because it's his fault if Cordy became what she became and it's his fault if we don't have a season 6 of Angel !
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No need to apologize & I think Cordelia is still a fantastic character and 1 bad season does not erase 6 fantastic seasons for me. BTVS S2 - Angel S3 + Angel S5 Cordelia is the one that's amazing! I love her

Also how did Joss get Angel cancelled?
I haven't heard of that.
 
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