• Thank you for visiting Buffy-Boards. You obviously have exceptional taste. We just want you to know that:

    1. You really should register so you can chat with us!

    2. Fourteen thousand people can't be wrong.

    3. Buffy-Boards loves you.

    4. See 1 through 3.

    Come on, register already!

Covers and Solicitations: BtVS Season 12 #2

Grace

Destructo-Girl
Joined
Mar 23, 2017
Messages
1,792
Black Thorn
I wonder if they will go into the future to a point before or after Buffy killed Willow. Buffy and Mel fighting makes me think after, but if we’re finding out why Future Dark Willow was so sad, maybe it will be before she dies and they’ll go find her, too.
Post automatically merged:

Maybe the Willow of the future will tell them about what happened when they failed to defeat Harth. Is that even possible? I hate making sense of time travel!
 
Last edited:
W

WillowFromBuffy

Guest
I am both intrigued and scared at the idea of Willow and Buffy being at odds. The last time they did Dark Willow - in Family Reunion - it was so lazy and out of character. If they are going to explain why Willow of the future believes she deserves to die, I want it to be for having done things that make sense to Willow's character.
 

Mrs Gordo

Bangel extremist...
Joined
Jul 11, 2017
Messages
4,043
Location
Texas
Black Thorn
I want it to be for having done things that make sense to Willow's character.

Yeah that’s what Angel fans said too. :)
Post automatically merged:

Oh idk I think being a fan of Buffy (the most prolific character in the verse) is ok....
 
Last edited:
W
WillowFromBuffy
Aw! It must be hard to be a fan of the most prolific character in the entire 'verse.

Grace

Destructo-Girl
Joined
Mar 23, 2017
Messages
1,792
Black Thorn
wait what it is with buffy killing willow? what did i miss again??

In the Time of Your Life arc in Season 8, Buffy is pulled into the far future by Dark Willow. Willow of our time is able to bring Buffy back, though Future Dark Willow manipulates events so that Buffy has to kill FDW before she goes back to the past (and it’s clear that was FDW’s aim all along, to get Buffy to kill her). We don’t know why yet, but are supposed to find out in Season 12. All we know is that Future Dark Willow is sad about it and that it’s “a long story.” FDW also wants Buffy to see Buffy’s “failure” (the future sucks and there was no slayer for a long time).

I don’t think our Willow knows that Buffy killed her in the future. (She wore a blindfold so she wouldn’t see the future, on the advice of her snake demon lady friend.) Someone correct me if Buffy tells Willow in a subsequent arc. It’s been a long time since I’ve read Season 8.
 
badsister
badsister
i need to re-read s8 too...i totally forgot this part. so many things were happening there no surprise i got confused. thank you!

badsister

Angel's Avenger
Joined
Apr 11, 2018
Messages
416
We don’t know why yet, but are supposed to find out in Season 12

again dark willow. i really hate it when they try to bring old plots and make it 'more epic than before'
it never works out!
 

thetopher

Member of the Church Of Faith
Joined
Dec 23, 2013
Messages
10,707
Location
The Moot, England
Sineya
Gorgeous cover art! Really evocative and dynamic. I might actually bother buying this season. Possibly.

again dark willow. i really hate it when they try to bring old plots and make it 'more epic than before'

I have to say that the only hope I've got for this season is that the writers are linking it all back to a more successful story line. 'Time Of Your Life' was an inventive arc, probably the closest the comics got to true 'crossover magic'.
Original plots in these Buffy comics have had less than stellar success it has to be said.

If their doing something interesting with the time-travel/Fray aspect then I could maybe have a glimmer of hope for some kind of ending that redeems what has gone before.

Yes, I'm a optimist slash glutton for punishment! Poke me in my hope-filled eyes!
 
badsister
badsister
no. i'm with you on this one. wearing rose tinted glasses all the way and hoping for the best
W

WillowFromBuffy

Guest
Oh idk I think being a fan of Buffy (the most prolific character in the verse) is ok....
Well, Angel appears in the most TV episodes and I think he may appear in more comic issues, too, but I haven't counted.
I don’t think our Willow knows that Buffy killed her in the future. (She wore a blindfold so she wouldn’t see the future, on the advice of her snake demon lady friend.) Someone correct me if Buffy tells Willow in a subsequent arc. It’s been a long time since I’ve read Season 8.
I am certain she doesn't know. Imagine her reaction when she finds out.

Did anyone else think Buffy was kinda nonchalant about killing Willow? Willow was powerless. There was no reason to think she could stop Buffy from going home. And Buffy just guts her without blinking. Maybe she - like the Fang Gang did with Angel - has been mentally preparing herself for having to do it one day.
All we know is that Future Dark Willow is sad about it and that it’s “a long story.” FDW also wants Buffy to see Buffy’s “failure” (the future sucks and there was no slayer for a long time).
My theory is that Willow messed up Buffy's final plan to destroy the vampires, and that it is due to Willow that there are still lurks and Harth and Fray got called.
 

Grace

Destructo-Girl
Joined
Mar 23, 2017
Messages
1,792
Black Thorn
Did anyone else think Buffy was kinda nonchalant about killing Willow? Willow was powerless. There was no reason to think she could stop Buffy from going home. And Buffy just guts her without blinking.

Buffy was depicted as crying her eyes out when she got back to the future, so I don't think she was nonchalant about it.

Buffy did seem to accept the situation fairly quickly, but she didn't have much time if she wanted to get home. Also, it was clear that it was what Future Dark Willow wanted. Did Buffy actually know that FDW was powerless? From Buffy's perspective, given the way FDW brought her 200 years into the future and set up a slayer to kill her, FDW probably didn't seem too weak.

My theory is that Willow messed up Buffy's final plan to destroy the vampires, and that it is due to Willow that there are still lurks and Harth and Fray got called.

That's an interesting theory. I think it would fit well with this description:

zzTKEfI.png

("Time" is FDW's answer, not to leave y'all hanging.)
 
W

WillowFromBuffy

Guest
That's an interesting theory. I think it would fit well with this description
Thanks. It's pretty much the plot of my first fanfic. Buffy destroys the supernatural -> Willow brings it back -> Willow becomes dark Willow.

It also fits well with S9.
 

Grace

Destructo-Girl
Joined
Mar 23, 2017
Messages
1,792
Black Thorn
Thanks. It's pretty much the plot of my first fanfic. Buffy destroys the supernatural -> Willow brings it back -> Willow becomes dark Willow.

Yeah, I can see that. :)

It also fits well with S9.

That is one of the things that I'm confused about, though. Would Buffy really try to end magic again after seeing that it was bad in Season 9? I feel like there was something about how creativity was dying and suicides were up or something along those lines. And Buffy knows from Season 11 how terrible it is to lose her powers. Would she rip away everyone's powers again?
 
W

WillowFromBuffy

Guest
That is one of the things that I'm confused about, though. Would Buffy really try to end magic again after seeing that it was bad in Season 9? I feel like there was something about how creativity was dying and suicides were up or something along those lines. And Buffy knows from Season 11 how terrible it is to lose her powers. Would she rip away everyone's powers again?
Well, if the supernatural represents freedom, empowerment, individualism, but also brutal violence, chaos and cruelty...

and the alternative to the supernatural represents safety, order, but also exploitation, loss of diversity, loss of individual freedom...

...then it is not an easy choice. Wasn't there a reference to an apocalypse in the first issue? Maybe Buffy felt forced to end magic again to save the world and Willow did something drastic to ensure she was not completely successful. The technocratic society of the Frayverse is the price for Buffy's victory, but Willow was able to throw a tiny spanner into the works. Now Willow has to watch Harth amass an army and kill people, knowing it is solely her own fault.
 

Mrs Gordo

Bangel extremist...
Joined
Jul 11, 2017
Messages
4,043
Location
Texas
Black Thorn
lol @WillowFromBuffy your banner cracks me up. I think I skimmed in another forum you have made some comments about how you think Angel on the cover looks like Spike? I'd like to hear more about that if possible. We can talk about Spike over here too you know. :)

To me (and @Mylie were talking about this) he kinda looks like early seasons Angel - like BtVS s1 angel - actually. With his longer hair and his v-neck white shirt.

vlcsnap-251605.png
(x)
shirtless-sighting-buffy-the-vampire-slayer-s1e7.jpg
(x)

Anyone else get the Angel from early btvs vibe? That would mean that Giles and Angel were both drawn like btvs s1. It could just be artist interpretation/inspiration OR it could be time traveling fun?
 

EarthLogic

Scooby
Joined
Sep 1, 2017
Messages
1,350
Location
London, UK
Black Thorn
@Mrs Gordo I think they're just trying to keep to a consistent 'youthful immortal' look now that they don't have to worry about an actor actually ageing, so artists often use S1/2 Angel for reference. A lot of the A&F covers are like that too.
 

Grace

Destructo-Girl
Joined
Mar 23, 2017
Messages
1,792
Black Thorn
@Mrs Gordo I think they're just trying to keep to a consistent 'youthful immortal' look now that they don't have to worry about an actor actually ageing, so artists often use S1/2 Angel for reference. A lot of the A&F covers are like that too.

Wow, Angel and Buffy should look the same age now, right? That never really occurred to me before.

@WillowFromBuffy, do you think the magic of the Buffyverse is personally connected to Willow now, since she brought it back? Would you have to kill Willow to end magic completely?
 
RomanticSoul
RomanticSoul
Pretty sure Buffy is older than Angel now. She is close to Spike than Angel IMO.

Mrs Gordo

Bangel extremist...
Joined
Jul 11, 2017
Messages
4,043
Location
Texas
Black Thorn
consistent 'youthful immortal' look

Angel has been drawn with an INCREDIBLE amount of variety in the comics. Angel in s11 looks old much older. Angel in s10 looks like Angel from AtS s1/2 to me. It's all over the place. But it's not just his physical look, its what he is wearing on the cover (same as what Giles is wearing). I'm trying to remember when the last time was that I saw Angel wearing a white v neck and jacket in the comics. I'll browse and see if I can find it any.

@RomanticSoul you think this nose is bad - go and look at Angel s11 - there was a few issues there were his nose was out of control.

It just depends on the illustrator. The nose doesn't bother me in this cover because I think it's more about angles but I also think I've grown to understand that Angel and many characters are drawn very differently depending on who gets their hands on them. And I try not to focus to much on looking exactly like DB or SMG or AH etc, and just go for the feel the illustrator is trying to give.

Also Connor was drawn like 100 times hotter than the actor on the show so I was super on board with that. :)
Post automatically merged:

@RomanticSoul the comic timeline isn't exactly clear. It's not been one season = one year especially since season 11 was so short. I read somewhere that Buffy is supposed to be late 20s right now which would place her at similar age that Angel was sired 26. She maybe slightly older 27/28? Spike was sired in his early 30s so I think she is probably somewhere in between the two ages. She hasn't hit her 30th birthday as best I can tell. I think if she did they would make a thing of it.
 

EarthLogic

Scooby
Joined
Sep 1, 2017
Messages
1,350
Location
London, UK
Black Thorn
Angel has been drawn with an INCREDIBLE amount of variety in the comics. Angel in s11 looks old much older. Angel in s10 looks like Angel from AtS s1/2 to me. It's all over the place.
I meant on the cover art. Interior art ranges from okay to just bizarre.

White v-neck: A&F #21 (another Steve Morris cover), S9 Library edn V1.
 

Mrs Gordo

Bangel extremist...
Joined
Jul 11, 2017
Messages
4,043
Location
Texas
Black Thorn
White v-neck: A&F #21 (another Steve Morris cover), S9 Library edn V1.

One of my favorite covers, although you can't tell if it's V neck but it is a plain white shirt. And he does look younger, longer hair etc in that cover as well. So similar feel.
 
W

WillowFromBuffy

Guest
lol @WillowFromBuffy your banner cracks me up. I think I skimmed in another forum you have made some comments about how you think Angel on the cover looks like Spike? I'd like to hear more about that if possible. We can talk about Spike over here too you know. :)
Ha! Thanks! I drop by the other board from time to time to see what our emigrated members are up to, but I don't really go there to discuss Spike :p As for the banner, there really isn't a lot to it. I just thought it was funny. Angel looks a lot like Spike, both in appearance and body language. Despite his image of withdrawn broodiness, Angel's body language is usually quite confident. He stands upright, he looks people in their eyes, he shows his hands, etc.

It is true, though, that David's appearances changes a lot during the two shows and his personality is slightly different in S1 of Buffy than later.

If you want to have a discussion about deeper similarities between Angel and Spike, though... I've always seen Spuffy as a retelling of the Bangel story, even a necessary retelling, because Spuffy makes explicit a lot of the subtext and allegory of Bangel. I doubt anyone will agree with me, though, so maybe I should just drop it :p

As I've said before, I am very happy to see Buffy and Angel reunited, and I dearly hope this reunion will be more fulfilling than the ones we have had since AtS started.

K1fqOh6.jpg
@WillowFromBuffy, do you think the magic of the Buffyverse is personally connected to Willow now, since she brought it back? Would you have to kill Willow to end magic completely?
I don't think that was Willow's motivation for bringing Buffy to the future. I think she was merely lonely and burned by guilt. A mix of wanting to die, missing her best friend and also resentment against Buffy made her summon Buffy to kill her. She talks about how it matters who kills you. Maybe Willow feels Buffy forced her into becoming Dark Willow again, so in that sense, Buffy had already killed the good Willow. It is all just speculation.

If you're talking about the way Willow brings back magic in S9, I am not really sure. I don't remember very well. There was something about Willow birthing it, wasn't there? But even if magic is not directly linked to Willow, she is certainly willing to defend it, even at great cost.
 
Top Bottom