Should Dawn have died instead of Buffy?

To the thread question - no.

If Dawn dies, then the bad guys have won.

But I have to say I find the idea that Buffy can die instead of Dawn quite contrived. And what if it had not worked ? Then Buffy would have died for nothing.

Overall the 5th season is my third favorite season, but the ending is somewhat, well, artificial.
 
I think as Buffy said and she usually sticks to her word on things that if she lost Dawn she would quit, genuinely believe that if it was made that Dawn ended up running into the mystical hellhole, that Buff might have done a runner like in season 3, but she might have never returned to Sunnydale at all, I mean what was waiting for her? She basically then would have lost everything in season 5 alone
 
Yes. The Knights of Byzantium, who were white Hats, most certainly did seem to think so, and they seemed to have the most information about the crisis.

In addition, if you killed Dawn via mystical death, then brought her back, no foul. Killing the key to end the portal wasn't against the rules. Bringing her back as a harmless girl isn't either. Instead, the slayer returns, violates the Furies's judgement, and gets the earth invaded and the watcher's council killed.
 
I consider The Knights of Byzantium to be a factual group and therefore not something made up in the show.
As the ball of energy was transformed into a girl - the sister of the slayer - was the entity that was the key taken out of all existence so Dawn taking a Swan Dive off the tower would have done nothing.
 
Miss Muffet said:
I've seen people talk about this topic before, but I haven't seen a thread for it, so I made one 🙂
Do you think Dawn should have sacrificed herself in 'The Gift' instead of Buffy? Why?
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I think it had to happen how it happened because of who Buffy was. She needed to do this herself because the audience would expect her to do whatever she can to save her sister. It would have been out of character for Buffy to have Dawn sacrifice herself instead because the whole episode was about Buffy’s fear of not saving her sister and to actually fail at that would not have been a good season finale in my opinion. Also season 6 would have been completely different if Buffy didn’t die and come back while having to struggle with coming back from the dead. I also didn’t like that we suddenly was forced to see Buffy have a sister since we always knew her of being the only child, but I think the writers did an amazing job making it seem like Dawn was always there. Heck, when I first watched the show, I was second guessing myself if I ever heard Buffy talk about having a sister that we didn’t fully get to see until season 5.

I think it’s important to also point out that a lot of people sees the season 5 finale as the true series finale and it would have been less impactful if the ending of Buffy was to see her fail.

Stake fodder said:
It would have been a lot more logical. For one thing, though I like Dawn, it is rather irksome in S5 that everyone else has to risk their lives to protect at all costs this person who didn't even exist a year ago. Secondly, the reasoning that Buffy could be substituted because they had the same blood was rather thin. Why couldn't she have offered herself up to Glory instead of Dawn in the first place then? That seems like something Buffy would do, to protect her sister, with the assumption that she could get out of it later somehow. It also makes some elements irrelevant, such as the Knights of Byzantium wanting to kill Dawn, since doing so would not have defeated Glory's aims.

But I agree with @Faded90 that it would have been anti-climactic for Dawn to die, and silly to reset the season as all a "horrible, horrible dream" (to quote Dallas). If it didn't reset, Buffy would have been undone by the guilt of Dawn dying. But then, that could have worked as well for her depression in S6, though she would no longer have Dawn to help pull her out of it.

So personally, I think Dawn should have sacrificed herself, but story-wise, it wouldn't work as well.
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Oh see now thinking about it this why kinda makes the whole “being the key” thing pointless if Buffy can also “unlock” it too… hmm.. I smell some type of plot hole. 🤔 Maybe one could argue that only Dawn could “unlock” it but someone else with the similar blood can still “close” it? It still doesn’t make any sense.
 
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RonWesley said:
But I have to say I find the idea that Buffy can die instead of Dawn quite contrived. And what if it had not worked ? Then Buffy would have died for nothing.
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I agree that while it’s emotionally satisfying it’s contrived. Some of the shows I’m really enjoying lately don’t have some magical “there’s always another way.”

To your second point I think that Buffy didn’t want to make the choice between Dawn or the world. She says at the beginning of the episode that she can’t keep living in this world if these are the choices that she has to make. If Buffy died and it didn’t work she doesn’t have to kill or sister or doom humanity.
 
KaitKat said:
I agree that while it’s emotionally satisfying it’s contrived. Some of the shows I’m really enjoying lately don’t have some magical “there’s always another way.”

To your second point I think that Buffy didn’t want to make the choice between Dawn or the world. She says at the beginning of the episode that she can’t keep living in this world if these are the choices that she has to make. If Buffy died and it didn’t work she doesn’t have to kill or sister or doom humanity.
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I completely agree with this
 
No. I think Buffy should’ve died and the show should’ve ended. The show is beloved still-but I think if it ended at season 5 it would be heralded as one of the greatest shows of all time. It’s a fantastic tragic ending. I also think the quality of the show continues to really dip after season 5.
 
Nah, Buffy's sacrifice/suicide worked well with the arc of that season. It could have been the ending to her story.

Also, Dawn is so precious, she obviously had to live..... @Old Master 3.0 😇
 
Yes.
But, I also understand why the writers did what they did. If the series was ending, it would've been a fitting way to end things.

This also could've been the running plot of Buffy's depression in s6. She failed Dawn, let her be sacrificed.

I like that Buff herself in s7 telling Giles that had she had her time over, she would've sacrificed Dawn for the greater good.
 
Production wise, I think it kinda had to happen, under the assumption the show was ending. Character arc wise, I think Buffy discovering Dawn was not real and treating as such, and then treating her as an object to be protected, then into to someone to sacrifice for, it also makes sense.
 
It always made more sense to me that Buffy died. Yes, she was far too young and it was incredibly unfair but she had still lived more of a life than Dawn. She had fallen in love and made many amazing friends that were like a family to her. She wanted Dawn to be able to experience these things for herself. Dawn was a literal child and Buffy's life was a ticking time bomb anyway as she was the slayer, whereas Dawn has a long life ahead of her. I think the season finale ended in the perfect way. I also just prefer Dawn as a character.
 
Generally, I would consider Glory to be an outer god, her actions were outside the Powers/Old Ones cold war that defines the series, but threatened both sides. So the agreement became, if Buffy can be persuaded to sacrifice herself, the Furies would accept that as a equivalent exchange for the life of the Key. That the whole plot of season 5, was just a higher power trying to prepare Buffy for that sacrifice, to teach her the way to end this. That's also why the First was able to declare war on the Slayers and the Watchers (and a disturbing number of Egyptian gods, for that matter), because the deal has been broken.

Or least, because that's what I go with, because "Summers blood" is an terrible conclusion.
 
TheXandyman said:
I think the fact that Buffy was resurrected was really interesting. If Dawn had jumped, we wouldn't have had that.
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This makes me wonder, if Dawn had jumped, would reality have been reset, and everyone have forgotten that she ever existed? Or would S6 have Buffy depressed because she didn't save Dawn, which might have been an even worse S6, because then she wouldn't have even had Dawn to be responsible for?
 
Personally I'd say that reality would remain the same even if Dawn died - I can't imagine that her death would undo the spell because then it would be like it never happened which would negate the portal opening in the first place.
 
Stake fodder said:
This makes me wonder, if Dawn had jumped, would reality have been reset, and everyone have forgotten that she ever existed? Or would S6 have Buffy depressed because she didn't save Dawn, which might have been an even worse S6, because then she wouldn't have even had Dawn to be responsible for?
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That could've been almost another 'I Will Remember You' plot. If Dawn jumped, reality would reset for everyone else - except for Buffy - maybe because of their blood connection?
 
hoponlilmama said:
That could've been almost another 'I Will Remember You' plot. If Dawn jumped, reality would reset for everyone else - except for Buffy - maybe because of their blood connection?
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And then Buffy's depression would have been even worse, because none of her friends would understand what she was so sad about.
 
Stake fodder said:
And then Buffy's depression would have been even worse, because none of her friends would understand what she was so sad about.
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This could definitely work as an alternative to what we got!

How about this - a bit of an edit on Tabula Rasa - the spell Willow does that has everyone forgetting, once broken brings back everyone's memories - including of Dawn.

Excuse me for a moment whilst I step into my DeLorean time machine to fix some issues with the show... 🤣
 
Stake fodder
Stake fodder
Excellent idea for Tabula Rasa!
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